TRV stuck


F

Fred

Hi,

I've got a radiator that is not warming up and I think the TRV is
stuck. I know this happens now and again. If you take the top off,
there is a pin. I can't remember, do I push it in or pull it out to
release it?

Would a little 3-in-1 or WD40 on it prevent this happening again?

Thanks.
 
Ad

Advertisements

H

Huge

Hi,

I've got a radiator that is not warming up and I think the TRV is
stuck. I know this happens now and again. If you take the top off,
there is a pin. I can't remember, do I push it in or pull it out to
release it?
Pull.

Don't pull *too* hard - I've known them come out completely, followed by a
little fountain of evil black water. And on Christmas Day, too....
 
C

chrisj.doran

Hi,

I've got a radiator that is not warming up and I think the TRV is
stuck. I know this happens now and again. If you take the top off,
there is a pin. I can't remember, do I push it in or pull it out to
release it?
Pull it out. Then check it's working by pushing it in and releasing it
a few times. The total movement is only a few millimetres.
Would a little 3-in-1 or WD40 on it prevent this happening again?
Lubricant might help, but usually they are stuck internally due to
crud inside.

A good tip is to open all the TRVs full when the heating goes off for
the summer. The only problem is that other people go around closing
them thinking "We don't need the radiators on in this weather." This,
of course, is the converse of the present problem where they whack
them up full because "The radiator's gone cold."

I do wonder how much "carbon" could be saved by an advertising
campaign to tell people how to use TRVs properly.

Chris
 
J

John Rumm

Fred said:
Hi,

I've got a radiator that is not warming up and I think the TRV is
stuck. I know this happens now and again. If you take the top off,
there is a pin. I can't remember, do I push it in or pull it out to
release it?
The pin is pushed to shut off the water flow. So if it is stuck down
then it is off.

Pulling it may free it, or you may find it is a free floating pin not
actually attached to the valve mechanism in which case pulling it will
make no difference.

A few gentle taps with a small hammer on the side of the valve may free it.
Would a little 3-in-1 or WD40 on it prevent this happening again?
Probably not...
 
N

newshound

A few gentle taps with a small hammer on the side of the valve may free
I find that often if you tap it inwards firmly with a small hammer it
displaces the crud, then springs out on the spring.
 
F

fred

Autolycus said:
Or getting rid of the wretched things completely and using
sensibly-positioned thermostats and motorised valves of a size and
design that you wouldn't mind having them visible. I have used Sauter
AXT111 actuators, but they're so far off being a mainstream product that
they're too expensive for many purposes - and difficult to find with
auxiliary switches.

Guess who's in the process of designing a heating system and wants it
fully zoned - 5 rooms - and adjustable to real, understood, temperature
values, and set without grovelling on the floor, trying to move a valve
between four-and-a-tiny-bit and four-and-a-tiny-bit-and-a-gnat's.
You could do worse than to look at the multizone RF system offered by
Honeywell, sorry I don't have the numbers but it should be easy to find.
IIRC, set points are sent to RF radiator valves and the control is done
locally. I have no time for the RF fad but think that the only way that
multizone control will reach the mass market is that way as both new
build and retrofit would find multizone cabling too costly. The
Honeywell system claims proportional control and the intelligence to
shut down heat in a room that has a window open for ventilation if
desired.

My own system has a zone valve for each room but controls for such a
system have to be home grown and proportional control using off the
shelf components is just not an option.
 
Ad

Advertisements

M

Mike Clarke

You could do worse than to look at the multizone RF system offered by
Honeywell, sorry I don't have the numbers but it should be easy to find.
IIRC, set points are sent to RF radiator valves and the control is done
locally.
<http://www.cm-zone.com/application.php?language=en> costs about
500 quid for a kit to control 6 existing TRVs. but only provides 2 zones. If
you wanted totally independent zones for each room you could add up to 3
extra CM67z controllers at about 80 quid each, providing 2 more zones per
controller.
 
L

Lobster

I do wonder how much "carbon" could be saved by an advertising
campaign to tell people how to use TRVs properly.
Damned right.

How many people (like SWMBO, to name but one) come into a cold house,
switch the heating on and crank up all the TRVs to max, rather than
leaving them set at 2-3 where they were previously set for a comfortable
operating temperature, because that way "they'll warm up quicker".

And then later - "bloody hell it's hot in here, I'll open the windows"

Bless her.

David
 
A

ARWadsworth

Lobster said:
Damned right.

How many people (like SWMBO, to name but one) come into a cold house,
switch the heating on and crank up all the TRVs to max, rather than
leaving them set at 2-3 where they were previously set for a comfortable
operating temperature, because that way "they'll warm up quicker".

And then later - "bloody hell it's hot in here, I'll open the windows"

Bless her.

David
Tell me about it. I used to be married to someone who was brought up in a
communist country where there were no such things as gas meters and bills in
the "very attractive" high rise flats she lived in. Heating on full 24/7 and
using the window as a thermostat.

Bless her my arse.


Adam
 
A

Andy Hall

Pull.

Don't pull *too* hard - I've known them come out completely, followed by a
little fountain of evil black water. And on Christmas Day, too....
That's what happens when you say you don't believe in God :)
 
J

John

Lobster said:
Damned right.

How many people (like SWMBO, to name but one) come into a cold house,
switch the heating on and crank up all the TRVs to max, rather than
leaving them set at 2-3 where they were previously set for a comfortable
operating temperature, because that way "they'll warm up quicker".

And then later - "bloody hell it's hot in here, I'll open the windows"

Bless her.

David
Try working in an office that has air conditioning - and women - and a
remote control for the thermostat.

Mmmm cold in here I will put it on 32! - then 16!
 
Ad

Advertisements

A

Andy Hall

Damned right.

How many people (like SWMBO, to name but one) come into a cold house,
switch the heating on and crank up all the TRVs to max, rather than
leaving them set at 2-3 where they were previously set for a
comfortable operating temperature, because that way "they'll warm up
quicker".

And then later - "bloody hell it's hot in here, I'll open the windows"

Bless her.

David
It's called an outer control loop - human hysteresis.

As soon as you have this control term in your system, forget about PWM
control of the boiler, anticycling and fine grained control.
 
F

fred

Lobster said:
Damned right.

How many people (like SWMBO, to name but one) come into a cold house,
switch the heating on and crank up all the TRVs to max, rather than
leaving them set at 2-3 where they were previously set for a comfortable
operating temperature, because that way "they'll warm up quicker".

And then later - "bloody hell it's hot in here, I'll open the windows"

Bless her.
Indeed, I have given up explaining the concept of thermostats and why
raising the setting does not result in an increase in comfort level, I
spend my time either slapping heads or installing tamperproof controls
:-/
 
F

fred

Mike Clarke said:
<http://www.cm-zone.com/application.php?language=en> costs about
500 quid for a kit to control 6 existing TRVs. but only provides 2 zones. If
you wanted totally independent zones for each room you could add up to 3
extra CM67z controllers at about 80 quid each, providing 2 more zones per
controller.
That's probably the one but I refuse to navigate such an appalling site
to confirm it. I think there is a route to expand it beyond the basic 2
zones.
 
M

Mike Clarke

[snip - comparison of Honeywell CM Zone Wireless system against hardwired
motorised valves]
Less sophisticated control, and it's more work wiring it all up, but
each item can be replaced if it fails by something functionally
identical from another maker, and it leaves £425 to spend on tools, or
sweets.
I'm inclined to agree there. I looked at the CM Zone option as a less
disruptive way of applying zones to our existing system but dismissed it as
an expensive approach with some practical drawbacks. If we were starting
from scratch I'd go for zones with motorised valves but I don't fancy the
disruption so I expect we'll settle for a relatively cheap and cheerful
addition of a CM927 to the existing system which has TRVs throughout but no
room stat.
 
H

Huge

Indeed, I have given up explaining the concept of thermostats and why
raising the setting does not result in an increase in comfort level, I
spend my time either slapping heads or installing tamperproof controls
I'm glad to see that it's not just my wife who does this.

I might as well replace the heating thermostat with one of those great big knife
switches out of a Frankenstein movie, because that's how she treats it.
 
Ad

Advertisements

A

Andrew Gabriel

Or getting rid of the wretched things completely and using
sensibly-positioned thermostats and motorised valves of a size and
design that you wouldn't mind having them visible. I have used Sauter
AXT111 actuators, but they're so far off being a mainstream product that
they're too expensive for many purposes - and difficult to find with
auxiliary switches.

Guess who's in the process of designing a heating system and wants it
fully zoned - 5 rooms - and adjustable to real, understood, temperature
values, and set without grovelling on the floor, trying to move a valve
between four-and-a-tiny-bit and four-and-a-tiny-bit-and-a-gnat's.
I suspect that maybe OTT.

I designed and installed central heating about 6 years ago.
I split into downstairs and upstairs zones with separate control.
I did accurate heatloss calculations for each room and sized the
rads appropriately. TRVs are fitted on all rads except in the two
rooms with thermostats, but I simply leave them fully open all
the time. With the radiators matching the heat loss from each
room, all rooms match each other temperature-wise, and when the
rooms with the stats are at the right temperature, so are all
the other rooms.

If I hadn't done accurate heat-loss calculations, then TRV's
would have been necessary to get desired temperatures, but with
proper heat-loss calcs and accurately sized rads, they aren't
doing anything. If I'd known how accurate my heat-loss calcs were,
I might not have bothered fitting the TRVs at the time. (However,
they or something equivalent are needed by Part L nowadays.)
 
A

Andrew Gabriel

I'm glad to see that it's not just my wife who does this.

I might as well replace the heating thermostat with one of those great big knife
switches out of a Frankenstein movie, because that's how she treats it.
I have what looks like regular Satchwell thermostats on the wall
(DRT-3451's for anyone interested), but inside they are just a
potentiometer, the setting of which is read by the computer which
controls my heating. The computer can be set to read them or to
use some specified setting and ignore them, so I can effectively
override the wall stat setting. That might be a way to resolve
this;-)

Alternatively, buy another wall stat and stick it to the wall
with double-sided sticky pads without connecting it to anything,
and tell the rest of the family that's the new thermostat:)
 
Ad

Advertisements

T

Tim Southerwood

Autolycus coughed up some electrons that declared:
five CM67 @ £60 - £300 (or would that have to be 4 plus
1 other of some sort?)
http://www.heizungsprofi24.de/haust...c-manager-hcm200d-mit-fernkomfortzugriff.html

Is the "1 other" that may be of interest. Not available[1] in the UK due to
Honeywell UK thinking that we're all too stupid to read the manual for such
a beast.

[1] But is available as part of a full installation service for lots of
wonga plus silly markup on the components.

Also available from www.smuk.at

HTH

Tim

PS Not tried it but read the specs, it looks pretty good.
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Top