OT how to flush my radiator, change the antifreeze

[mm]

This is OT, but I asked in my Chrysler mailing list and no one in the
usually busy list has answered in 18 hours, except one who tried, only
wrt the last, unrelated line.


Well, I can't believe it but I've forgotten how to change the
anti-freeze. This must be the start of Oldtimers Disease.

It was 70 degrees in Baltimore yesterday, and a good day to flush the
cooling system. Lebaron, ''95, 3.0L V6.

I ran the engine until it was hot or at least warm.

The petcock opens with no tools -- that's nice.

I drained the coolant into one of those rectangular bottles that lie
in their side; I removed the thermostat and flushed for 5 minutes with
a garden hose in the radiator neck until the water ran clear. Let it
drain, put back the petcock, put back the thermostat, filled the
radiator with 50/50, but it took less than a gallon.

Ran the engine a minute or two until I realized that maybe I had only
filled the radiator.

Went to see if I could add more coolant, but I couldn't. Usually I
can keep adding and adding, even when it starts way above empty.

I added about 3 quarts, when the capacity is 8.

After sitting all night, today I could add a 3 or 4 ounces more.

Could it be I never drained the engine after all? How could that be
when I removed the thermostat and the petcock and after flushing let
it sit until nothing was coming out of the petcock hole.?


P.S. I also got a Felpro gasket for the thermostat and it has a
brown plastic ring on the inside circumference on one side. But
nothing on the card to say which side of the gasket goes up. Which
does?

 

[harry]

This is OT, but I asked in my Chrysler mailing list and no one in the
usually busy list has answered in 18 hours, except one who tried, only
wrt the last, unrelated line.

Well, I can't believe it but I've forgotten how to change the
anti-freeze.  This must be the start of Oldtimers Disease.

It was 70 degrees in Baltimore yesterday, and a good day to flush the
cooling system.    Lebaron, ''95, 3.0L V6.

I ran the engine until it was hot or at least warm.

The petcock opens with no tools -- that's nice.

I drained the coolant into one of those rectangular bottles that lie
in their side; I removed the thermostat and flushed for 5 minutes with
a garden hose in the radiator neck until the water ran clear.   Let it
drain, put back the  petcock, put back the thermostat, filled the
radiator with 50/50, but it took less than a gallon.

Ran the engine a minute or two until I realized that maybe I had only
filled the radiator.

Went to see if I could add more coolant, but I couldn't.  Usually I
can keep adding and adding, even when it starts way above empty.

I added about 3 quarts, when the capacity is 8.

After sitting all night, today I could add a 3 or 4 ounces more.

Could it be I never drained the engine after all?  How could that be
when I removed the thermostat and the petcock and after flushing let
it sit until nothing was coming out of the petcock hole.?

P.S.    I also got a Felpro gasket for the thermostat and it has a
brown plastic ring on the inside circumference on one side.  But
nothing on the card to say which side of the gasket goes up.  Which
does?

I didn't know anyone changed anti-freeze anymore. I just top mine up
with neat anti-freeze & then I'm sure it's not too weak.
If you have poured ant-freeze in to capacity and run the engine, it
must be full I would have thought, the pump would push any air locks
out. Have you run the engine with the radiator fill cap off, this
usually lets any air out?
Is there an "overflow" and does it go to an expansion bottle?

 

[cavedweller]

I didn't know anyone changed anti-freeze anymore. I just top mine up
with neat anti-freeze & then I'm sure it's not too weak.
If you have poured ant-freeze in to capacity and run the engine, it
must be full I would have thought, the pump would push any air locks
out.  Have you run the engine with the radiator fill cap off, this
usually lets any air out?
Is there an "overflow" and does it go to an expansion bottle?

You really know your Mitsubishi engines, don't you?

 

[A. Baum]

I didn't know anyone changed anti-freeze anymore. I just top mine up
with neat anti-freeze & then I'm sure it's not too weak. If you have
poured ant-freeze in to capacity and run the engine, it must be full I
would have thought, the pump would push any air locks out. Have you run
the engine with the radiator fill cap off, this usually lets any air
out?
Is there an "overflow" and does it go to an expansion bottle?

It's not a bad idea to flush a cooling system occasionally. You can make
your own hose fitting to reduce the hoses to 3/4 water hose with little
trouble. Remove the thermostat and replace the housing. Flush into the
housing and collect the coolant from thew bottom hose or valve on the
bottom or side tank. I've done this on a 2003 GM to get rid of the Dex-
Cool antifreeze known to destroy intake manifold gaskets, with standard
green Prestone. You have to flush the Dex because if the two mix it forms
solids that could clog coolant passages. That was 4 years ago and at 80K
miles everything works perfect. Can't help with the gasket issue, call a
parts store or service department and find out from them .

 

[N8N]

This is OT, but I asked in my Chrysler mailing list and no one in the
usually busy list has answered in 18 hours, except one who tried, only
wrt the last, unrelated line.

Well, I can't believe it but I've forgotten how to change the
anti-freeze.  This must be the start of Oldtimers Disease.

It was 70 degrees in Baltimore yesterday, and a good day to flush the
cooling system.    Lebaron, ''95, 3.0L V6.

I ran the engine until it was hot or at least warm.

The petcock opens with no tools -- that's nice.

I drained the coolant into one of those rectangular bottles that lie
in their side; I removed the thermostat and flushed for 5 minutes with
a garden hose in the radiator neck until the water ran clear.   Let it
drain, put back the  petcock, put back the thermostat, filled the
radiator with 50/50, but it took less than a gallon.

Ran the engine a minute or two until I realized that maybe I had only
filled the radiator.

Went to see if I could add more coolant, but I couldn't.  Usually I
can keep adding and adding, even when it starts way above empty.

I added about 3 quarts, when the capacity is 8.

After sitting all night, today I could add a 3 or 4 ounces more.

Could it be I never drained the engine after all?  How could that be
when I removed the thermostat and the petcock and after flushing let
it sit until nothing was coming out of the petcock hole.?

P.S.    I also got a Felpro gasket for the thermostat and it has a
brown plastic ring on the inside circumference on one side.  But
nothing on the card to say which side of the gasket goes up.  Which
does?

you only drained the radiator, not the block. There may or may not be
a block drain. It probably isn't a petcock but a pipe plug (although
you can replace it with a petcock if you can find one the right size.)

When refilling, you should always use concentrated antifreeze, put 1/2
the printed capacity of your cooling system in there then fill with
water. Reason being you never can drain the entire cooling system,
and you want to make sure that you have the proper mixture in there.
Right now, you probably don't - you probably have mostly water because
you flushed it.

nate

 

[Smitty Two]

I didn't know anyone changed anti-freeze anymore. I just top mine up
with neat anti-freeze & then I'm sure it's not too weak.

Well, that's a spectacularly bad idea. Anti-freeze makes a shitty
coolant. It's there to keep the real coolant - water - from freezing.

 

[mm]

I didn't know anyone changed anti-freeze anymore.

3 or 4 years ago, I was going to get the long-life antifreeze, 5 years
iirc, until I read the label and it said that there couldn't be any of
the regular kind in the system for it to be long-life, that if there
was some, the new stuff would only last 2 years.

AFAIK everyone diligent still changes their antifreeze every 2 or 5
years.

I just top mine up
with neat anti-freeze & then I'm sure it's not too weak.

Old antifreeze is as good as new antifreeze about not freezing, but
there are anti-corrosion and lubricating additives, and maybe others
that they say deteriorate. I would think that the anti-corrosion
additives combine with whatever causes corrosion and thus gets used
up. Just came across a web page that claimed the increased number of
aluminum parts required more continued anti-corrosion strength.

If you have poured ant-freeze in to capacity and run the engine, it
must be full I would have thought,

Me too. But I only added 3 quarts.

the pump would push any air locks
out. Have you run the engine with the radiator fill cap off, this
usually lets any air out?

Yes, I've run it for a couple minutes with the cap off. Before, this
was always enough for the level to go down so I could add more, and
then more.

Is there an "overflow" and does it go to an expansion bottle?

There is an overflow hose and bottle, but I haven't run it with the
cap on and haven't run it long enough to get hot and overflow, so
whatever is there was there before.

It gave one bubble while I was watching, but the fluid level went down
little if anything. When the engine is cold the thermostat is shut,
so I figured the new fluid would enter through the bottom and the air
would escape...somehow. But if the air could escape, the air could
also enter when the engine was draining, and the engine would have
drained when the radiator did. And it would take 8 quarts to fill it.

There's a big chuckhole in the road near here. Maybe I should go
drive over that.

I found a lot of webpages about changing antifreeze, and all but one
said nothing about the thermostat, not even to consider changing the
thermostat when changing the antifreeze. Lots of webpages about
flushing the engine and not a one about removing the thermostat to
help this. Even though one page went into the fact that the
thermostat closes when it's cold. -- They all seemed to talk about
flushing the radiator and not about flushing the engine.


---And I couldn't have added more than 3 quarts. I only went outside
with 7 quarts of 50/50 and I haven't opened the bottle that I had
filled, so that leaves only 3 quarts or less that are in it now.

Someone gave me two part-filled bottles of 50/50, so I'm using them.
Usually when it is empty, I put in a whole gallon of 100% antifreeze,
then finish off with water, about a gallon.

Thanks.

MM

 

[The Daring Dufas]

Well, that's a spectacularly bad idea. Anti-freeze makes a shitty
coolant. It's there to keep the real coolant - water - from freezing.

It also raises the boiling point of the coolant not to mention the
lubrication properties for the water pump and anti-corrosion additives
to protect the different metals in the cooling system.

TDD

 

[Meat Plow]

It also raises the boiling point of the coolant not to mention the
lubrication properties for the water pump and anti-corrosion additives
to protect the different metals in the cooling system.

TDD

<nods>

Pure antifreeze has about half the heat transfer capability that H2O
does.

 

[mm]

<nods>

Pure antifreeze has about half the heat transfer capability that H2O
does.

Plus it freezes at a higher temperature than a mixture of water and
antifreeze.

Although I think Harry only said he topped his off with pure
anti-freeze, so if it doesn't use much water, that is, much coolant,
it would still have plenty of water.

Unless the cooling system is empty, what I do with each new gallon of
antifreeze I get is, pour half of it into an empty antifreeze gallon,
and fill the rest of each with water, so I have two gallons of 50/50.
When I've had leaks, I carry one bottle with me. I thought about
alternating between water and antifreeze for topping off, but the math
was too complicated, and I coudln't predict what ratio I would get.

 

[The Daring Dufas]

Plus it freezes at a higher temperature than a mixture of water and
antifreeze.

Although I think Harry only said he topped his off with pure
anti-freeze, so if it doesn't use much water, that is, much coolant,
it would still have plenty of water.

Unless the cooling system is empty, what I do with each new gallon of
antifreeze I get is, pour half of it into an empty antifreeze gallon,
and fill the rest of each with water, so I have two gallons of 50/50.
When I've had leaks, I carry one bottle with me. I thought about
alternating between water and antifreeze for topping off, but the math
was too complicated, and I coudln't predict what ratio I would get.

I use a 50/50 mix in my vehicles.

TDD

 

[ransley]

This is OT, but I asked in my Chrysler mailing list and no one in the
usually busy list has answered in 18 hours, except one who tried, only
wrt the last, unrelated line.

Well, I can't believe it but I've forgotten how to change the
anti-freeze.  This must be the start of Oldtimers Disease.

It was 70 degrees in Baltimore yesterday, and a good day to flush the
cooling system.    Lebaron, ''95, 3.0L V6.

I ran the engine until it was hot or at least warm.

The petcock opens with no tools -- that's nice.

I drained the coolant into one of those rectangular bottles that lie
in their side; I removed the thermostat and flushed for 5 minutes with
a garden hose in the radiator neck until the water ran clear.   Let it
drain, put back the  petcock, put back the thermostat, filled the
radiator with 50/50, but it took less than a gallon.

Ran the engine a minute or two until I realized that maybe I had only
filled the radiator.

Went to see if I could add more coolant, but I couldn't.  Usually I
can keep adding and adding, even when it starts way above empty.

I added about 3 quarts, when the capacity is 8.

After sitting all night, today I could add a 3 or 4 ounces more.

Could it be I never drained the engine after all?  How could that be
when I removed the thermostat and the petcock and after flushing let
it sit until nothing was coming out of the petcock hole.?

P.S.    I also got a Felpro gasket for the thermostat and it has a
brown plastic ring on the inside circumference on one side.  But
nothing on the card to say which side of the gasket goes up.  Which
does?

Antifreeze is bad when it goes acidic or is electricaly conductive, an
easy test is how it conducts electricity [Google for it I dont have it
written down] but I think .04v is bad, a lead in in the antifreeze
and one on ground, or a Ohm test is possible. Use a tester to test
percentage, dont go above 50% as you can overheat in summer and not
cool the motor. Antifreeze does not transfer heat nearly as well as
water. Redline, Water Wetter is a good booster. Your motor needs
corosion inhibitors due to dissimiliar metals. You motor may need
factory or spec stuf so be carefull. Antifreezes now last longer, but
different motors may have different specs from different metals used.
Google is the best help on this.

 

[mm]

Antifreeze is bad when it goes acidic or is electricaly conductive, an
easy test is how it conducts electricity [Google for it I dont have it
written down] but I think .04v is bad, a lead in in the antifreeze
and one on ground, or a Ohm test is possible. Use a tester to test
percentage, dont go above 50% as you can overheat in summer and not
cool the motor. Antifreeze does not transfer heat nearly as well as
water. Redline, Water Wetter is a good booster. Your motor needs
corosion inhibitors due to dissimiliar metals. You motor may need
factory or spec stuf so be carefull. Antifreezes now last longer, but
different motors may have different specs from different metals used.
Google is the best help on this.

This is all good to know. Thanks.

In this case I wanted to flush the system because it looked like
mud**.

So I want to flush the engine, not just the radiator. And especially
the heater because I don't seem to get enough heat anymore, even
though the thermometer says the engine is pretty hot.

I don't want the water to just ciculate. I want it do so quickly to
wash away the mud that clings a bit to the walls, at least it does on
the radiator cap and in the neck of the radiator. Any way short of
finding a hole in the engine block to flush the engine too.

Who flushes only the radiator anyhow?


**The radiator was leaking some, long story omitted, so I put in some
kind of stop leak. That didn't work so I put in another kind. The
second and probably the first were Barr's Leak, but they make 4 kinds
now iirc.

Well that stopped the leak, but a year later I notice it looks like
mud.

 

[hallerb]

3 or 4 years ago, I was going to get the long-life antifreeze, 5 years
iirc, until I read the label and it said that there couldn't be any of
the regular kind in the system for it to be long-life, that if there
was some, the new stuff would only last 2 years.

AFAIK everyone diligent still changes their antifreeze every 2 or 5
years.


Old antifreeze is as good as new antifreeze about not freezing, but
there are anti-corrosion and lubricating additives, and maybe others
that they say deteriorate. I would think that the anti-corrosion
additives combine with whatever causes corrosion and thus gets used
up.   Just came across a web page that claimed the increased number of
aluminum parts required more continued anti-corrosion strength.


Me too.                     But I only added 3 quarts..


Yes, I've run it for a couple minutes with the cap off.  Before, this
was always enough for the level to go down so I could add more, and
then more.


There is an overflow hose and bottle, but I haven't run it with the
cap on and haven't run it long enough to get hot and overflow, so
whatever is there was there before.

It gave one bubble while I was watching, but the fluid level went down
little if anything.   When the engine is cold the thermostat is shut,
so I figured the new fluid would enter through the bottom and the air
would escape...somehow.   But if the air could escape, the air could
also enter when the engine was draining, and the engine would have
drained when the radiator did.  And it would take 8 quarts to fill it.

There's a big chuckhole in the road near here.  Maybe I should go
drive over that.

I found a lot of webpages about changing antifreeze, and all but one
said nothing about the thermostat, not even to consider changing the
thermostat when changing the antifreeze.  Lots of webpages about
flushing the engine and not a one about removing the thermostat to
help this.   Even though one page went into the fact that the
thermostat closes when it's cold. -- They all seemed to talk about
flushing the radiator and not about flushing the engine.

---And I couldn't have added more than 3 quarts.  I only went outside
with 7 quarts of 50/50 and I haven't opened the bottle that I had
filled, so that leaves only 3 quarts or less that are in it now.

Someone gave me two part-filled bottles of 50/50, so I'm using them.
Usually when it is empty, I put in a whole gallon of 100% antifreeze,
then finish off with water, about a gallon.

Thanks.

MM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

a friend refused to fush his cooling system till one day his car
overheated he was on a trip and had to be towed in to a garage.

his coolant had turned to mush, it was 15 years old and congealed to
mush that wouldnt flow.

it clogged his radiator, he ended up with one day at the dealer.

new radiator, all new hoses, well they were 15 years old, new water
pump, basically a cooling system rebuild....

normally he does all his own repairs, so the cost over 1500 bucks had
him mad, but he was 90 miles from home and was too cheap to spend the
extra for AAA plus 100 mile towing...

he now admits coolant should be changed every couple years, theres a
flush and fill adapter that fits on the heater hose to make it
easy.....

 

[Joe]

snip<

Considering all the risks and disposal problems, you can get the job
done better at a good auto service shop. They now use recycling rigs
with the right kind of additives and have some decent test methods as
well. Check around for prices and then decide if your really want to
fritter away your time on something that you can't do as well.

Joe

 

[JIMMIE]

This is OT, but I asked in my Chrysler mailing list and no one in the
usually busy list has answered in 18 hours, except one who tried, only
wrt the last, unrelated line.

Well, I can't believe it but I've forgotten how to change the
anti-freeze.  This must be the start of Oldtimers Disease.

It was 70 degrees in Baltimore yesterday, and a good day to flush the
cooling system.    Lebaron, ''95, 3.0L V6.

I ran the engine until it was hot or at least warm.

The petcock opens with no tools -- that's nice.

I drained the coolant into one of those rectangular bottles that lie
in their side; I removed the thermostat and flushed for 5 minutes with
a garden hose in the radiator neck until the water ran clear.   Let it
drain, put back the  petcock, put back the thermostat, filled the
radiator with 50/50, but it took less than a gallon.

Ran the engine a minute or two until I realized that maybe I had only
filled the radiator.

Went to see if I could add more coolant, but I couldn't.  Usually I
can keep adding and adding, even when it starts way above empty.

I added about 3 quarts, when the capacity is 8.

After sitting all night, today I could add a 3 or 4 ounces more.

Could it be I never drained the engine after all?  How could that be
when I removed the thermostat and the petcock and after flushing let
it sit until nothing was coming out of the petcock hole.?

P.S.    I also got a Felpro gasket for the thermostat and it has a
brown plastic ring on the inside circumference on one side.  But
nothing on the card to say which side of the gasket goes up.  Which
does?

Fill the radiator with the Tstat and housing removed until you see
anti-freeze in the block. Put the tstat and housing on and finish
filling the radiator. Take a drive and check again. Works for my
Nissan, Jeep and Chevy trucks

Jimmie

 

[mm]

Fill the radiator with the Tstat and housing removed until you see
anti-freeze in the block. Put the tstat and housing on and finish
filling the radiator. Take a drive and check again. Works for my
Nissan, Jeep and Chevy trucks

That sounds like a very good idea. And it's not too late to take off
the housing and see what the level is in the chamber below it. It
was empty of fluid when I put the housing back on**. And what the
level in the radiator is as best I can tell, before and after.

The worst can happen is that I lose what is in the hose, and the
radiator above the bottom of the hose. That's not much.

**Evidence that I had drained the engine, at least somewhat, and if
somewhat, why not all the way? So why did it only take 3 quarts.

It's supposed to be 47 tomorrow. Not my first choice, but warm
enough.

 

[Stormin Mormon]

Which is fine for top offs. But, less fine when flushing out
the system, and refilling.

Ideally, the coolant mix is 50-50. Less than ideal is when
dealing with an ignorant mechanic or ignorant home owner who
doesn't understand the concept. I've had both.

The premix 50-50 is far more expensive than buying straight
antifreeze, and diluting it yourself.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

Plus it freezes at a higher temperature than a mixture of
water and
antifreeze.

Although I think Harry only said he topped his off with
pure
anti-freeze, so if it doesn't use much water, that is,
much coolant,
it would still have plenty of water.

Unless the cooling system is empty, what I do with each
new gallon of
antifreeze I get is, pour half of it into an empty
antifreeze gallon,
and fill the rest of each with water, so I have two
gallons of 50/50.
When I've had leaks, I carry one bottle with me. I
thought about
alternating between water and antifreeze for topping off,
but the math
was too complicated, and I coudln't predict what ratio I
would get.

I use a 50/50 mix in my vehicles.

TDD

 

[The Daring Dufas]

Which is fine for top offs. But, less fine when flushing out
the system, and refilling.

Ideally, the coolant mix is 50-50. Less than ideal is when
dealing with an ignorant mechanic or ignorant home owner who
doesn't understand the concept. I've had both.

The premix 50-50 is far more expensive than buying straight
antifreeze, and diluting it yourself.

Who said anything about BUYING 50/50 premix? Go back and read
my post or I will quote it here:

"I use a 50/50 mix in my vehicles."

I keep empty gallon jugs, the ones with the little markings that
show the amount of liquid in the jug. Pour half the contents of
a new gallon jug of antifreeze into an empty gallon jug, dilute
with clean or distilled water and "Presto!"(no pun)you have two
gallons of 50/50 mix! ^_^

TDD

 

[harry]

You really know your Mitsubishi engines, don't you?

Explain how flushing out a Mitsubishi engine helps it?