More questions on home-made wooden garage doors

Discussion in 'UK DIY' started by Al 1953, Mar 30, 2010.

  1. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    Some of you offered some helpful advice on my recent home-made garage
    door question. After reading some of the responses, and chewing it over,
    I decided to make the doors out of timber instead of WBP ply. I purchased
    tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to be exact. I also
    got some 5" x 1" planed whitewood for the bracing. For the bracing' I'm
    thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with diagonals in-between. I am
    planning to have no vertical bracing at the edges, as the tongu+grooved
    timber is nearly an inch thick, and seems very rigid, If the doors seem
    too flexible after they are constructed, I can always add vertcals later.

    Before I assemble the doors, I could do with some advice on joining and
    finishing. I've ourchased waterproof wood glue, thinking I should glue
    the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I assum this is correct?

    To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do, and should also
    use waterproof glue?

    As for finishing, I'd like the fnished doors to look as decent quality as
    possible, so they'll hopefully add value to the property (if that's
    possible using the relatively cheap softwood..). I imagne there are a
    number of options. As I like the look of wood, especially if it were
    stained to look more like hardwood or a redder form of redwood, would
    something like a coloured preservative be OK (such as tge Cuprinol stuff
    sold in B&Q for sheds and fences) , or is regular oil-based paint (and
    lots of it) going to the greatest longevity and the least need for
    repainting in years to come?

    How about the door frame, which buts up to the concrete blockwork? Should
    I apply preservative before painting. Or, again, will a tinted
    preservative do?



    Many thanks,

    AL
     
    Al 1953, Mar 30, 2010
    #1
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  2. Al 1953

    Steve Walker Guest

    Al 1953 wrote:

    Engage Father Jack Mode....

    > Before I assemble the doors, I could do with some advice on joining and
    > finishing. I've ourchased waterproof wood glue, thinking I should glue
    > the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I assum this is correct?


    YESH!

    > To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do, and should also
    > use waterproof glue?


    YESH!

    > As for finishing, I'd like the fnished doors to look as decent quality as
    > possible, so they'll hopefully add value to the property (if that's
    > possible using the relatively cheap softwood..). I imagne there are a
    > number of options. As I like the look of wood, especially if it were
    > stained to look more like hardwood or a redder form of redwood, would
    > something like a coloured preservative be OK (such as tge Cuprinol stuff
    > sold in B&Q for sheds and fences) , or is regular oil-based paint (and
    > lots of it) going to the greatest longevity and the least need for
    > repainting in years to come?


    YESH!

    > How about the door frame, which buts up to the concrete blockwork? Should
    > I apply preservative before painting. Or, again, will a tinted
    > preservative do?


    YESH!


    Good luck, Al - sounds like it will be a smart job.
     
    Steve Walker, Mar 30, 2010
    #2
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  3. Al 1953

    Steve Firth Guest

    Steve Walker <> wrote:

    > Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    > Engage Father Jack Mode....
    >
    > > Before I assemble the doors, I could do with some advice on joining and
    > > finishing. I've ourchased waterproof wood glue, thinking I should glue
    > > the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I assum this is correct?

    >
    > YESH!


    Hmm, I'm not sure about that. If using T&G I wouldn't glue the tongues
    because te wood is going to move and it's probably best if it's as free
    as possible to do so. If glue is used the wood may split.

    I made a wooden garage door using similar materials a few years ago. It
    still looks good. It was nailed rather than glued.
     
    Steve Firth, Mar 30, 2010
    #3
  4. Al 1953

    Cash Guest

    Steve Walker wrote:
    > Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    > Engage Father Jack Mode....
    >
    >> Before I assemble the doors, I could do with some advice on joining
    >> and finishing. I've ourchased waterproof wood glue, thinking I
    >> should glue the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I assum this
    >> is correct?

    >
    > YESH!


    No, that will cause problems with natural movement - which will be taken up
    by the T&G design of the board. Simply nail the boards to the fram using
    oval head rust-proof nails, punched in and filled.

    >> To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do, and should
    >> also use waterproof glue?

    >
    > YESH!


    A bit of over-kill using screws, nails will do, as the board will be nailed
    to the braces as well. and the downward pressure of the outside edge of the
    door will tighten everything up.

    Also make sure that the braces are no 'flatter' than 45 degrees and point
    'upwards' from the hanging side to the slamming side. If they are placed
    the other way around, they will be useless as a brace, and you may as well
    leave them out - as the door will drop anyway.

    >> As for finishing, I'd like the fnished doors to look as decent
    >> quality as possible, so they'll hopefully add value to the property
    >> (if that's possible using the relatively cheap softwood..). I imagne
    >> there are a number of options. As I like the look of wood,
    >> especially if it were stained to look more like hardwood or a redder
    >> form of redwood, would something like a coloured preservative be OK
    >> (such as tge Cuprinol stuff sold in B&Q for sheds and fences) , or
    >> is regular oil-based paint (and lots of it) going to the greatest
    >> longevity and the least need for repainting in years to come?

    >
    > YESH!


    "YESH!" - is not quite true - as untanalised, cheap, fourth of fifth grade
    timber will not last more than around ten years (and rot will set in long
    before that).

    >> How about the door frame, which buts up to the concrete blockwork?
    >> Should I apply preservative before painting. Or, again, will a tinted
    >> preservative do?

    >
    > YESH!


    Give the frame a chance and give it five coats of good quality paint (rather
    than 'tinted preservative) [1] - and also keep the frame about 20mm up off
    the floor to prevent the end grain (probably untreated anyway) from 'sucking
    up' rain water off the floor.

    [1] Prepare the timber properly and give it the following:

    1 - Coat of aluminium base primer (or similar)
    2 - Coats of oil based undercoat
    2 - coats of oil based gloss

    Rubbing down lightly between each coat - and this 'should' delay the onset
    of early rot.

    Cash
     
    Cash, Mar 31, 2010
    #4
  5. On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 19:35:01 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:

    > I purchased tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to be
    > exact.


    Yipes, I hope you've thought about the weight and the hinges to
    support them...

    > For the bracing' I'm thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with
    > diagonals in-between. I am planning to have no vertical bracing at the
    > edges, as the tongu+grooved timber is nearly an inch thick, and seems
    > very rigid,


    My gut feeling is that won't work, or not work as well as diagonal
    across the corners of a box. I can't pin down why I feel it won't
    work, other than "no triangle". I could be wrong, the fact that you
    have 3/4" boards might be enough but they will slide past each other.

    > I can always add vertcals later.


    The horizontals really need to be mortised into the verticals and
    possibly the diagonal braces jointed in as well.

    > thinking I should glue the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I
    > assum this is correct?


    I wouldn't the boards will want move and if glued they can't. I
    wouldn't be surprised to see 1/4" variation across the width of each
    of those boards between the "wet" and "dry" states of the timber.

    > To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do,


    If you can get good quality zinc plated yes but screws vary immensely
    in the quality of the plating and in the steel. Brass or stainless
    might be a better choice. I don't use anything but brass, stainless
    or hot dipped clouts outside up here. Steel screws or nails just
    doen't last.

    > As I like the look of wood, especially if it were stained to look more
    > like hardwood or a redder form of redwood, would something like a
    > coloured preservative be OK (such as tge Cuprinol stuff sold in B&Q for > sheds and fences) ,


    Be careful of shed/fence stuff, some is designed to work on rough
    sawn timber and doesn't adhere to planed at all well.

    > or is regular oil-based paint (and lots of it) going to the greatest
    > longevity and the least need for repainting in years to come?


    The full preservative, prime, undercoat, gloss system works very
    well. We have some Dulux Weathershield (Ithink) that has been on a
    south facing window frame for the best part of ten years. Where it
    was thin on the beading it's come away but on the solid timber of the
    frmaes it is still in good sound condition. Trouble is as bit's have
    failed it all needs taking right back and redoing...

    Take a look at (some of) the Sikens range, these weather but you just
    lightly rub down and slap another coat on, not taking right back and
    starting again.

    --
    Cheers
    Dave.
     
    Dave Liquorice, Mar 31, 2010
    #5
  6. "Cash" <.............\\@...............//.com> wrote:

    >Also make sure that the braces are no 'flatter' than 45 degrees and point
    >'upwards' from the hanging side to the slamming side. If they are placed
    >the other way around, they will be useless as a brace, and you may as well
    >leave them out - as the door will drop anyway.
    >

    Am I not the only person who can't help but notice braces which
    are not?

    Chris
    --
    Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


    Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.
     
    Chris J Dixon, Mar 31, 2010
    #6
  7. Al 1953

    stuart noble Guest

    Dave Liquorice wrote:
    > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 19:35:01 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    >> I purchased tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to be
    >> exact.

    >
    > Yipes, I hope you've thought about the weight and the hinges to
    > support them...
    >
    >> For the bracing' I'm thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with
    >> diagonals in-between. I am planning to have no vertical bracing at the
    >> edges, as the tongu+grooved timber is nearly an inch thick, and seems
    >> very rigid,

    >
    > My gut feeling is that won't work, or not work as well as diagonal
    > across the corners of a box. I can't pin down why I feel it won't
    > work, other than "no triangle". I could be wrong, the fact that you
    > have 3/4" boards might be enough but they will slide past each other.
    >
    >> I can always add vertcals later.

    >
    > The horizontals really need to be mortised into the verticals and
    > possibly the diagonal braces jointed in as well.
    >
    >> thinking I should glue the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I
    >> assum this is correct?

    >
    > I wouldn't the boards will want move and if glued they can't. I
    > wouldn't be surprised to see 1/4" variation across the width of each
    > of those boards between the "wet" and "dry" states of the timber.
    >
    >> To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do,

    >
    > If you can get good quality zinc plated yes but screws vary immensely
    > in the quality of the plating and in the steel. Brass or stainless
    > might be a better choice. I don't use anything but brass, stainless
    > or hot dipped clouts outside up here. Steel screws or nails just
    > doen't last.
    >
    >> As I like the look of wood, especially if it were stained to look more
    >> like hardwood or a redder form of redwood, would something like a
    >> coloured preservative be OK (such as tge Cuprinol stuff sold in B&Q for > sheds and fences) ,

    >
    > Be careful of shed/fence stuff, some is designed to work on rough
    > sawn timber and doesn't adhere to planed at all well.
    >
    >> or is regular oil-based paint (and lots of it) going to the greatest
    >> longevity and the least need for repainting in years to come?

    >
    > The full preservative, prime, undercoat, gloss system works very
    > well. We have some Dulux Weathershield (Ithink) that has been on a
    > south facing window frame for the best part of ten years. Where it
    > was thin on the beading it's come away but on the solid timber of the
    > frmaes it is still in good sound condition. Trouble is as bit's have
    > failed it all needs taking right back and redoing...
    >
    > Take a look at (some of) the Sikens range, these weather but you just
    > lightly rub down and slap another coat on, not taking right back and
    > starting again.
    >


    The weak point rot-wise will probably be the grooves between the boards
    on the lower part of the doors. Water finds its way into the t&g joints
    where it can't easily evaporate.
    There is *something* to be said for coating all the components in wood
    hardener before assembly, including the individual tongues and grooves,
    although the colour would need to be established beforehand. It
    effectively applies a thin film of hard plastic. I've done this
    successfully on window sills, but never tried it on anything bigger.
    The movement of the wood shouldn't be significant unless it cops the
    midday sun (whatever that is). Joinery grade redwood is normally
    supplied at 17% average moisture content and rarely dries beyond 15%
    outdoors, which equates to a shrinkage of around half a percent across
    the width. How quickly it responds to changes in the weather depends on
    the quality of the timber. IME dense, close-grained (expensive) stuff
    doesn't move about with every little change in the weather, but will
    tend to tune into the average ambient conditions over 6 months or so.
     
    stuart noble, Mar 31, 2010
    #7
  8. Al 1953

    Guest


    > Am I not the only person who can't help but notice braces which
    > are not?


    It's not uncommon to see commercially-made ledged and braced doors
    subsequently fitted the wrong way round.

    Some supply the brace loose (haven't seen this for a long time), some
    supply specific left and right hand doors, and more commonly now
    universal fitments with the upper and lower braces coming to an
    arrowhead point on the centre rail - so one of them has to be the
    right way round.

    The braces should also be let slightly into the rails.

    How wide are these garage doors?

    Ledged and braced may tend to drop/lack rigidity - framed ledges and
    braced is much better, although quite a bit more work.
     
    , Mar 31, 2010
    #8
  9. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "Dave Liquorice" <> wrote in
    news::

    > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 19:35:01 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    >> I purchased tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to
    >> be exact.

    >
    > Yipes, I hope you've thought about the weight and the hinges to
    > support them...


    Well, I bought four very hefty galvanised hinges costing £17 a pair. I'm
    more concerned about the strength of the framme and its attachment to the
    wall than anything. I've used 120mm hammer fixings ( 4 per vertical). I
    now wish I'd applied preservative to all faces before fixing, but too
    late now.

    >> For the bracing' I'm thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with
    >> diagonals in-between. I am planning to have no vertical bracing at
    >> the edges, as the tongu+grooved timber is nearly an inch thick, and
    >> seems very rigid,

    >
    > My gut feeling is that won't work, or not work as well as diagonal
    > across the corners of a box. I can't pin down why I feel it won't
    > work, other than "no triangle". I could be wrong, the fact that you
    > have 3/4" boards might be enough but they will slide past each other.


    Now I understand bracing better, I'm thinking maybe have the braces
    parallel, like this:

    http://shedbuilder.info/How-To-Build-A-Shed-Door.html

    No jambs/verticals in that design either.

    > I wouldn't the boards will want move and if glued they can't. I
    > wouldn't be surprised to see 1/4" variation across the width of each
    > of those boards between the "wet" and "dry" states of the timber.


    I've since read that priming the tongues and grooves prior to assembly is
    considered sensible. Thanks to you, and all others, for the other
    suggestions and advice.

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Mar 31, 2010
    #9
  10. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    stuart noble <> wrote in
    news:jiEsn.336507$2:

    > Dave Liquorice wrote:
    >> On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 19:35:01 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:
    >>
    >>> I purchased tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to
    >>> be exact.

    >>
    >> Yipes, I hope you've thought about the weight and the hinges to
    >> support them...
    >>
    >>> For the bracing' I'm thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with
    >>> diagonals in-between. I am planning to have no vertical bracing at
    >>> the edges, as the tongu+grooved timber is nearly an inch thick, and
    >>> seems very rigid,

    >>
    >> My gut feeling is that won't work, or not work as well as diagonal
    >> across the corners of a box. I can't pin down why I feel it won't
    >> work, other than "no triangle". I could be wrong, the fact that you
    >> have 3/4" boards might be enough but they will slide past each other.
    >>
    >>> I can always add vertcals later.

    >>
    >> The horizontals really need to be mortised into the verticals and
    >> possibly the diagonal braces jointed in as well.
    >>
    >>> thinking I should glue the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I
    >>> assum this is correct?

    >>
    >> I wouldn't the boards will want move and if glued they can't. I
    >> wouldn't be surprised to see 1/4" variation across the width of each
    >> of those boards between the "wet" and "dry" states of the timber.
    >>
    >>> To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do,

    >>
    >> If you can get good quality zinc plated yes but screws vary immensely
    >> in the quality of the plating and in the steel. Brass or stainless
    >> might be a better choice. I don't use anything but brass, stainless
    >> or hot dipped clouts outside up here. Steel screws or nails just
    >> doen't last.
    >>
    >>> As I like the look of wood, especially if it were stained to look
    >>> more like hardwood or a redder form of redwood, would something like
    >>> a coloured preservative be OK (such as tge Cuprinol stuff sold in
    >>> B&Q for > sheds and fences) ,

    >>
    >> Be careful of shed/fence stuff, some is designed to work on rough
    >> sawn timber and doesn't adhere to planed at all well.
    >>
    >>> or is regular oil-based paint (and lots of it) going to the greatest
    >>> longevity and the least need for repainting in years to come?

    >>
    >> The full preservative, prime, undercoat, gloss system works very
    >> well. We have some Dulux Weathershield (Ithink) that has been on a
    >> south facing window frame for the best part of ten years. Where it
    >> was thin on the beading it's come away but on the solid timber of the
    >> frmaes it is still in good sound condition. Trouble is as bit's have
    >> failed it all needs taking right back and redoing...
    >>
    >> Take a look at (some of) the Sikens range, these weather but you just
    >> lightly rub down and slap another coat on, not taking right back and
    >> starting again.
    >>

    >
    > The weak point rot-wise will probably be the grooves between the
    > boards on the lower part of the doors. Water finds its way into the
    > t&g joints where it can't easily evaporate.
    > There is *something* to be said for coating all the components in wood
    > hardener before assembly, including the individual tongues and
    > grooves, although the colour would need to be established beforehand.
    > It effectively applies a thin film of hard plastic.


    I'm not familiar with the stuff. Is it significantly better bet than wood
    primer for this purpose?

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Mar 31, 2010
    #10
  11. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "" <> wrote in news:8000b39e-4a7d-47a6-bb10-
    :


    > The braces should also be let slightly into the rails.


    Cutting those inset joints looks a bit fiddly for a carpentry novice like
    me. I bought some 'timber joining plates' (with spickes sticking out of one
    side, for hammering into the timber, accross a join. Probably not as good
    as letting inti the rails as you suggested.
    >
    > How wide are these garage doors?


    Each door is 4ft wide, and 7ft tall.

    > Ledged and braced may tend to drop/lack rigidity - framed ledges and
    > braced is much better, although quite a bit more work.


    More weight, too. I was hoping the thickness of the T&G boards will obviate
    the need for jambs.

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Mar 31, 2010
    #11
  12. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "Cash" <.............\\@...............//.com> wrote in
    news::

    > Give the frame a chance and give it five coats of good quality paint
    > (rather than 'tinted preservative) [1] - and also keep the frame about
    > 20mm up off the floor to prevent the end grain (probably untreated
    > anyway) from 'sucking up' rain water off the floor.


    I did think of that (raising it off the floor). I probably should have
    painted the frame on all faces before fixing to the wall too, but I didn't.
    >
    > [1] Prepare the timber properly and give it the following:
    >
    > 1 - Coat of aluminium base primer (or similar)
    > 2 - Coats of oil based undercoat
    > 2 - coats of oil based gloss


    I was thinking of leaving the door and frame unpainted for the whole of
    this summer, and then painting it all, in September, after it has become
    well dried out and seasoned. Would you condone that idea? It's West-facing,
    by the way.

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Mar 31, 2010
    #12
  13. On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 20:08:21 +0000, Al 1953 wrote:
    > Now I understand bracing better, I'm thinking maybe have the braces
    > parallel, like this:
    >
    > http://shedbuilder.info/How-To-Build-A-Shed-Door.html
    >
    > No jambs/verticals in that design either.


    Hmm, aren't those diagonal braces the wrong way round? Shouldn't they be
    flipped so that they transfer load along the brace's length to the hinge
    side of the door?

    Agree with the 'riffle' though (is that a genuine term?) - it'll reduce
    the tendency for the diagonal brace to try and slide against the
    horizontals.

    Regarding vertical braces, I'm not sure they do add much to the strength.
    They'll reduce the tendency to warp or for the door to twist, but you can
    probably do without them if you want given that you've got an inch of
    material already.

    As for hinges, hard to tell how big is "big enough", although I think I'd
    use three per door. Like you say, mountings are more important. I think
    when I come to rebuild my garage doors I'll put metal plates on the
    reverse side of the doors and bolt the hinges right through the doors and
    the plates behind (ditto with the jambs).

    cheers

    Jules
     
    Jules Richardson, Mar 31, 2010
    #13
  14. On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:04:37 +0000 (UTC), Jules Richardson wrote:

    >> http://shedbuilder.info/How-To-Build-A-Shed-Door.html
    >>
    >> No jambs/verticals in that design either.


    But it's a small, light, shed door.

    > Hmm, aren't those diagonal braces the wrong way round? Shouldn't they be
    > flipped so that they transfer load along the brace's length to the hinge
    > side of the door?


    I thought that as well, or fit the hinges to left as we see it not
    the right.


    --
    Cheers
    Dave.
     
    Dave Liquorice, Apr 1, 2010
    #14
  15. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    Jules Richardson <> wrote in
    news:hp0dd5$1n6$-september.org:

    > Hmm, aren't those diagonal braces the wrong way round?


    Yes! I didn't notice that...

    > Regarding vertical braces, I'm not sure they do add much to the
    > strength. They'll reduce the tendency to warp or for the door to
    > twist, but you can probably do without them if you want given that
    > you've got an inch of material already.


    Glad to hear someone support this notion. If the finished door seems too
    twisty or flimsy, I can add vertical jambs

    > As for hinges, hard to tell how big is "big enough", although I think
    > I'd use three per door. Like you say, mountings are more important. I
    > think when I come to rebuild my garage doors I'll put metal plates on
    > the reverse side of the doors and bolt the hinges right through the
    > doors and the plates behind (ditto with the jambs).


    Luckily, I had a real life pair of wooden garage doors (on a gargae I
    have access to) to look at for guidance. They are obviously quite old,
    maybe 20 years, and are still working fine, and still fit well. They have
    two hinges per door, but they are hefty items, with square holes to take
    coach bolts.

    Two hinges per door will hopefully be adequate, because I'm now planning
    on only two horizontals per door, with one diagonal brace per door (after
    reading some of the comments here). Each hinge will be bolted through a
    horizontal, of course.

    Here's what I bought (though I got mine from Jewsons at a lower price):
    http://tinyurl.com/yfakzzl

    One thing that I'm pondering about is the "axle housings" for want of a
    better term. They screw onto the outside face of the door frame, using 6
    crews. That is obviously the Achilles heel, security-wise, unless the
    screws are made unscrewable somehow, after they are in place. To achieve
    this, I'm thinking filling the slots with epoxy or even butchering the
    slots with a drill to render the slots useless. Anyone got other methods
    to share?

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Apr 1, 2010
    #15
  16. Al 1953

    stuart noble Guest


    >> The weak point rot-wise will probably be the grooves between the
    >> boards on the lower part of the doors. Water finds its way into the
    >> t&g joints where it can't easily evaporate.
    >> There is *something* to be said for coating all the components in wood
    >> hardener before assembly, including the individual tongues and
    >> grooves, although the colour would need to be established beforehand.
    >> It effectively applies a thin film of hard plastic.

    >
    > I'm not familiar with the stuff. Is it significantly better bet than wood
    > primer for this purpose?
    >

    It's designed to soak into old, porous timber and effectively convert
    the fibres to plastic. On new wood it's more likely to sit on the
    surface, but my limited tests suggest it beats the hell out of anything
    else as a sealer. I've always painted over it so I can't comment on how
    it would respond to UV exposure in a transparent finish.
     
    stuart noble, Apr 1, 2010
    #16
  17. Al 1953

    Guest


    > One thing that I'm pondering about ...


    If you're really bothered about that, once everything is mounted up
    and the doors fit etc, drill an extra hole through the hinge-pin plate
    and put a coach bolt right through to the inside of the building.

    It's a bit overkill for ledged and braced timber doors anyway (unless
    they're massively constructed), as they don't have the structure to
    hold back even a moderately serious go at a forced entry.
     
    , Apr 1, 2010
    #17
  18. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "Dave Liquorice" <> wrote in
    news::

    > On Thu, 1 Apr 2010 07:32:36 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    >> Glad to hear someone support this notion. If the finished door seems
    >> too twisty or flimsy, I can add vertical jambs

    >
    > But without any real connection to the horizontals (there must be a
    > real name for them, stiles?). On a normal door they would be tightly
    > morticed together and the brace(s) notched in. The cladding is then
    > just that decorative cladding, things do change with 3/4" T&G
    > "cladding" but I don't know in what way.
    >
    >> One thing that I'm pondering about is the "axle housings" for want of
    >> a better term.

    >
    > Hinge pins.
    >
    >> They screw onto the outside face of the door frame, using 6 crews.

    >
    > Why faff about undoing the crews when you can just lift the door off,
    > maybe?


    I was thinking of having the hinge pins pointing in opposite directions,
    but actually my door closes into the fram and the top frame member is
    steel, so I'll keep them the same way. Yes, the lowlife could attack with
    grinder, but that would make noise which would be heard.

    But yes, I am probably verging on overkill as there are other security
    measures in place around the property.

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Apr 1, 2010
    #18
  19. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "" <> wrote in news:5125136b-7182-4d97-b233-
    :

    >
    >> One thing that I'm pondering about ...

    >
    > If you're really bothered about that, once everything is mounted up
    > and the doors fit etc, drill an extra hole through the hinge-pin plate
    > and put a coach bolt right through to the inside of the building.
    >
    > It's a bit overkill for ledged and braced timber doors anyway (unless
    > they're massively constructed), as they don't have the structure to
    > hold back even a moderately serious go at a forced entry.


    Good comments thanks. I like your bolt idea though so I'll probably do
    that..

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Apr 1, 2010
    #19
  20. Al 1953

    Al 1953 Guest

    "Dave Liquorice" <> wrote in
    news::

    > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 19:35:01 +0000 (UTC), Al 1953 wrote:
    >
    >> I purchased tongue & grooved redwood floorboarding (22mm x 135mm) to
    >> be exact.

    >
    > Yipes, I hope you've thought about the weight and the hinges to
    > support them...
    >
    >> For the bracing' I'm thinking three equally-spaced horizontals with
    >> diagonals in-between. I am planning to have no vertical bracing at
    >> the edges, as the tongu+grooved timber is nearly an inch thick, and
    >> seems very rigid,

    >
    > My gut feeling is that won't work, or not work as well as diagonal
    > across the corners of a box. I can't pin down why I feel it won't
    > work, other than "no triangle". I could be wrong, the fact that you
    > have 3/4" boards might be enough but they will slide past each other.
    >
    >> I can always add vertcals later.

    >
    > The horizontals really need to be mortised into the verticals and
    > possibly the diagonal braces jointed in as well.
    >
    >> thinking I should glue the grooves before tapping in the tongues, I
    >> assum this is correct?

    >
    > I wouldn't the boards will want move and if glued they can't. I
    > wouldn't be surprised to see 1/4" variation across the width of each
    > of those boards between the "wet" and "dry" states of the timber.
    >
    >> To fix the bracing, will zink plated wood screws will do,

    >
    > If you can get good quality zinc plated yes but screws vary immensely
    > in the quality of the plating and in the steel. Brass or stainless
    > might be a better choice. I don't use anything but brass, stainless
    > or hot dipped clouts outside up here. Steel screws or nails just
    > doen't last.



    What about galvanised nails, for nailing the boards (galvanised ovals if
    there is such a thing)?

    Al
     
    Al 1953, Apr 1, 2010
    #20
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