Breaker Panel....Neutral bus


M

MB

I'm going to be adding a few breakers into the main service
panel...Right now there is 1 neutral/ground bus that is full. I am
going to add another bus....I've been told just to screw it directly
into the metal panel and that will bond it..... I would think that I
would need to jump it to the existing bus but the guy at the home depot
(i know..i know) says not to...

any ideas?
 
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R

RBM

You want good contact with the neutral conductor which is attached to the
existing buss, so definitely install a substantial size jumper to the
existing buss
 
P

Pete C.

RBM said:
You want good contact with the neutral conductor which is attached to the
existing buss, so definitely install a substantial size jumper to the
existing buss
More importantly you want to maintain the UL rating of your panel, so
look it up on the manufacturers site and determine if there is an add on
or larger replacement neutral bus bar available. If the bus bar is the
largest available for the panel and it's full then presumably the panel
is also maxed out with tandem breakers and a full panel replacement may
be in order.

Pete C.
 
H

hallerb

I would add a bus bar screw it directly too the existing cabinet then
add a heavy ground wire or two between the new and old bus bars.

its a pretty cheap straightforward project just dont overload the
cabinet to the point its jammed, if thats a issue then replace the
cabinet.

i did this on a house I recently sold it passed 2 home inspections and
more importandly middle group inspection too.
 
B

Bud--

Pete said:
More importantly you want to maintain the UL rating of your panel, so
look it up on the manufacturers site and determine if there is an add on
or larger replacement neutral bus bar available. If the bus bar is the
largest available for the panel and it's full then presumably the panel
is also maxed out with tandem breakers and a full panel replacement may
be in order.

Pete C.
I agree manufacturer is important for UL. The panel may have a ground
bar that can be installed. This information is often on the panel label.

bud--
 
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J

John Grabowski

MB said:
I'm going to be adding a few breakers into the main service
panel...Right now there is 1 neutral/ground bus that is full. I am
going to add another bus....I've been told just to screw it directly
into the metal panel and that will bond it..... I would think that I
would need to jump it to the existing bus but the guy at the home depot
(i know..i know) says not to...

any ideas?
Usually there are enough neutral bar slots to accommodate all of the
circuits that the electrical panel is rated to have. I am wondering if your
panel is maxed out. There should be a label on the inside of the cover or
the panel that tells you exactly how many circuit breakers are allowed in
the panel. Also, some neutral bars are approved to have more than one
ground wire under a screw terminal. That would be stated on the label also.
It may help free up some slots by combining some ground wires under one
screw.
 
G

Goedjn

Usually there are enough neutral bar slots to accommodate all of the
circuits that the electrical panel is rated to have. I am wondering if your
panel is maxed out. There should be a label on the inside of the cover or
This is not true for either my old panel, or the replacement
panel. I've always wondered why.
 
J

John Grabowski

Goedjn said:
This is not true for either my old panel, or the replacement
panel. I've always wondered why.
Read the label. It may permit multiple wires under one screw.
 
H

hallerb

You can mix grounds and neutrals on a MAIN panel ONLY!

Sub panels they must be seperate!

this directly from a middle group inspector
 
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J

John Grabowski

You can mix grounds and neutrals on a MAIN panel ONLY!

Sub panels they must be seperate!

this directly from a middle group inspector

That may be his interpretation, but in terms of what a particular panel has
been approved for, the label provides the correct information.

Last week I got a call from a customer who was selling her 25 year old
house. The buyer's home inspector noted that the ground wire and the
neutral wire for each circuit were terminated under the same screw. The
buyer wanted that corrected. Upon removal of the cover I noticed that there
weren't enough spare screw terminals for all of the ground wires. I read
the cover label and it said that it was permissible to install up to 3
ground wires under each screw terminal that did not contain a neutral wire.
By doing that, I had plenty of room for all of the ground wires and was able
to keep each neutral wire under a screw by itself.


John Grabowski
http://www.mrelectrician.tv
 
M

Member, Takoma Park Volunteer Fire Department

You can mix grounds and neutrals on a MAIN panel ONLY!

Sub panels they must be seperate!

this directly from a middle group inspector
The poster you were replying to was trying to indicate that you may not
terminate grounds and neutrals under the same screw. To do so would be
specifically prohibited by US National Electrical Code Section
408.41 Grounded Conductor Terminations.
Each grounded conductor shall terminate within the panelboard in an
individual terminal that is not also used for another conductor.
 
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M

Mr.E

The poster you were replying to was trying to indicate that you may not
terminate grounds and neutrals under the same screw. To do so would be
specifically prohibited by US National Electrical Code Section
408.41 Grounded Conductor Terminations.
Each grounded conductor shall terminate within the panelboard in an
individual terminal that is not also used for another conductor.
An opinion: The existing panel buss is approved for neutral
conductors. Add a ground buss, bonding to the can and a main bonding
jumper to the neutral buss sized per code. Put all neutrals on
original neutral bar and all grounds on grounding bar added.

A retired Inspector..
 

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