Potterton Profile won't light?

Discussion in 'Misc DIY' started by Dean Heighington, Jul 4, 2004.

  1. Typical Sunday night saga!

    I have a Potterton Profile boiler situated
    in my garage which provides heat for my
    CH and HW (Gravity fed).

    I have tinkered many times with my CH/HW
    system adding and replacing parts etc and
    have always managed to get her fired up with
    no hassles.

    This time she just hums (fan presumably) but
    no pilot light nor fire-up occurs!

    Gas, power, demand and water is there (at least
    I'm sure that water is there because the pump in
    the airing cupboard sounds like it's pumping water)
    and, in fact I never shut the system down... I just
    turned the programmer to "off" the other day
    as it was hot and I didn't want it kicking in come
    the morning!

    The model is either a 30e, 40e, 50e, 60e or 80e
    the manual covers all and I can't be arsed to go
    down while writing this :)
    I'm starting to be convinced that something has
    gone in the boiler itself such as the Overheat
    thermostat and was wondering if anyone here
    can offer up some suggestions before I call in
    am engineer?

    I've tried the manual reset button but that hasn't
    had any effect although it doesn't seem to have
    a satisfying click to the button when pushed...
    should it?

    Appreciate any pointers.

    cheers
    deano.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 4, 2004
    #1
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  2. Dean Heighington

    Ed Sirett Guest

    On Sun, 04 Jul 2004 11:16:41 -0700, Dean Heighington wrote:

    > Typical Sunday night saga!
    >
    > I have a Potterton Profile boiler situated
    > in my garage which provides heat for my
    > CH and HW (Gravity fed).
    >
    > I have tinkered many times with my CH/HW
    > system adding and replacing parts etc and
    > have always managed to get her fired up with
    > no hassles.
    >
    > This time she just hums (fan presumably) but
    > no pilot light nor fire-up occurs!
    >
    > Gas, power, demand and water is there (at least
    > I'm sure that water is there because the pump in
    > the airing cupboard sounds like it's pumping water)
    > and, in fact I never shut the system down... I just
    > turned the programmer to "off" the other day
    > as it was hot and I didn't want it kicking in come
    > the morning!
    >
    > The model is either a 30e, 40e, 50e, 60e or 80e
    > the manual covers all and I can't be arsed to go
    > down while writing this :)
    > I'm starting to be convinced that something has
    > gone in the boiler itself such as the Overheat
    > thermostat and was wondering if anyone here
    > can offer up some suggestions before I call in
    > am engineer?
    >
    > I've tried the manual reset button but that hasn't
    > had any effect although it doesn't seem to have
    > a satisfying click to the button when pushed...
    > should it?
    >

    The reset button, I beleive will only go in with a click when it has
    previously popped out. I'm not sure but I think the fan would also be dead in
    that case aswell.

    When the fan has run for a few seconds the APS should flick over to start
    the rest of the ignition switch.

    The chances are that this switch has failed, or its supply tube inlets are
    blocked.

    The manual is downloadable (I would expect) and that should help you to
    track down the fault.


    --
    Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
    The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
    Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
    Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
    Ed Sirett, Jul 4, 2004
    #2
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  3. "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:

    > The reset button, I beleive will only go in with a click when it has
    > previously popped out. I'm not sure but I think the fan would also be dead in
    > that case aswell.
    >
    > When the fan has run for a few seconds the APS should flick over to start
    > the rest of the ignition switch.
    >
    > The chances are that this switch has failed, or its supply tube inlets are
    > blocked.
    >
    > The manual is downloadable (I would expect) and that should help you to
    > track down the fault.


    Hi Ed.

    When I turn the Thermostat knob to off and then back on again,
    the humming (fan) starts immediately and then there is an
    audible click... this is the point where previously, the next sound
    was the pilot light click and then the roar of the burners. Now,
    I only seem to get the initial click after the fan hum!

    Could this be blocked jets? The heating has been off for a while
    because of the Summer heat!

    With regards the downloadable manual, is there somewhere you
    know that I can get this? I have tried the Potterton website and
    they only seem to have the "User's Guide" which I already have!

    Thanks for your help.

    Dean.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 5, 2004
    #3
  4. Dean Heighington

    Sparks Guest


    >
    > I've tried the manual reset button but that hasn't
    > had any effect although it doesn't seem to have
    > a satisfying click to the button when pushed...
    > should it?
    >
    > Appreciate any pointers.
    >
    > cheers
    > deano.


    Does the fan stay on permanently, or does it cycle on/off?

    I had a problem with my Potterton Profile, the fan would kick in, it would
    click, then just after the point it would normally light, the fan would go
    off, it would wait a couple of seconds, then repeat until it was turned off.
    It turned out to be the control board (well, something on it anyway!)

    I replaced the board, and we had heat!

    Before I replaced the board, I found sharply banging the bottom of the plate
    the board was mounted on *** just when it should be lighting "fixed" it -
    but this needed to be done every time it wanted to light!

    ***This board does carry mains voltage, so be careful if tinkering with it
    all switched on!***

    Sparks...
    Sparks, Jul 5, 2004
    #4
  5. Dean Heighington

    Ed Sirett Guest

    On Mon, 05 Jul 2004 19:16:07 +0100, Sparks wrote:

    >
    >>
    >> I've tried the manual reset button but that hasn't
    >> had any effect although it doesn't seem to have
    >> a satisfying click to the button when pushed...
    >> should it?
    >>
    >> Appreciate any pointers.
    >>
    >> cheers
    >> deano.

    >
    > Does the fan stay on permanently, or does it cycle on/off?
    >
    > I had a problem with my Potterton Profile, the fan would kick in, it would
    > click, then just after the point it would normally light, the fan would go
    > off, it would wait a couple of seconds, then repeat until it was turned off.
    > It turned out to be the control board (well, something on it anyway!)
    >
    > I replaced the board, and we had heat!
    >
    > Before I replaced the board, I found sharply banging the bottom of the plate
    > the board was mounted on *** just when it should be lighting "fixed" it -
    > but this needed to be done every time it wanted to light!
    >
    > ***This board does carry mains voltage, so be careful if tinkering with it
    > all switched on!***
    >
    > Sparks...


    This is because the relay does not swich over in response to the APS.
    Hitting it might just give it the help it needs. The OP would have
    mentioned the on-off-on-off cycling as its so distictive.


    --
    Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
    The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
    Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
    Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
    Ed Sirett, Jul 5, 2004
    #5
  6. Dean Heighington

    Ed Sirett Guest

    On Mon, 05 Jul 2004 02:00:14 -0700, Dean Heighington wrote:

    > "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:
    >
    >> The reset button, I beleive will only go in with a click when it has
    >> previously popped out. I'm not sure but I think the fan would also be dead in
    >> that case aswell.
    >>
    >> When the fan has run for a few seconds the APS should flick over to start
    >> the rest of the ignition switch.
    >>
    >> The chances are that this switch has failed, or its supply tube inlets are
    >> blocked.
    >>
    >> The manual is downloadable (I would expect) and that should help you to
    >> track down the fault.

    >
    > Hi Ed.
    >
    > When I turn the Thermostat knob to off and then back on again,
    > the humming (fan) starts immediately and then there is an
    > audible click... this is the point where previously, the next sound
    > was the pilot light click and then the roar of the burners. Now,
    > I only seem to get the initial click after the fan hum!
    >
    > Could this be blocked jets? The heating has been off for a while
    > because of the Summer heat!
    >
    > With regards the downloadable manual, is there somewhere you
    > know that I can get this? I have tried the Potterton website and
    > they only seem to have the "User's Guide" which I already have!
    >
    > Thanks for your help.
    >
    >


    The manual is on their web site (it is for the 40eL and 80eL models but
    these are essentially identical to any of the profile range).

    It includes a fault fininding flow chart (p32) but it is better to know how the
    sequence works and identify the problem yourself.

    Profiles have a two stage ignition.
    First a small pilot jet is opened (after the fan is proved OK by the APS)
    This is ignited with a series of sparks.
    Upon satisfcatory flame detection the main gas valve is opened.

    Sounds like the fan and APS are doing the stuff.
    So are there any sparks? NO - ivestigate spark problems. YES investigate
    gas/ignition problems.


    --
    Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
    The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
    Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
    Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
    Ed Sirett, Jul 5, 2004
    #6
  7. "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:<
    > > I've tried the manual reset button but that hasn't
    > > had any effect although it doesn't seem to have
    > > a satisfying click to the button when pushed...
    > > should it?
    > >

    > The reset button, I beleive will only go in with a click when it has
    > previously popped out. I'm not sure but I think the fan would also be dead in
    > that case aswell.
    >
    > When the fan has run for a few seconds the APS should flick over to start
    > the rest of the ignition switch.
    >
    > The chances are that this switch has failed, or its supply tube inlets are
    > blocked.
    >
    > The manual is downloadable (I would expect) and that should help you to
    > track down the fault.


    Thanks Ed
    I'll get the manual next free period and have a study.
    Will probably be back here at some stage to confirm
    fault identification or with more questions.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 13, 2004
    #7
  8. raden <> wrote in message news:<>...
    > Fans usually "hum" when the part which holds the bearing in place
    > breaks.
    >
    > However ....
    >
    > The click sounds like the APS is actually changing over
    >
    > which would indicate that the fan is working
    >
    > Ring me tomorrow on 01923 229224, I'll see if I can home in on the
    > problem


    Geoff (?)
    Have only just seen your reply [sorry - hectic schedule of
    work/life balance :) ]
    When I next get some free time, this will be my subject of
    study, I'll get hold of the profile manual and if I can't fathom
    this myself, would it be OK to still call you for some assistance?

    Many thanks,

    Dean.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 13, 2004
    #8
  9. "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:
    > This is because the relay does not swich over in response to the APS.


    APS?
    Automatic Protection System (Switch) ??

    d.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 13, 2004
    #9
  10. "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:
    > This is because the relay does not swich over in response to the APS.


    APS?
    Automatic Protection System (Switch) ??

    d.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 13, 2004
    #10
  11. raden <> wrote in message news:<>...

    > When you say fan hum, is it actually turning?
    >
    > Fans usually "hum" when the part which holds the bearing in place
    > breaks.


    You got it right first time!
    The fan was humming, but not spinning.
    I removed the front panel which made this obvious
    and so I took the fan out and connected it to a flex
    with a 3amp plug and switched this on... the fan spun
    for about 5 seconds and then seized up and made
    the humming I'd heard earlier.

    A quick trip to my local Plumb Center (and £102+VAT
    later - which I did think was extortionate - but worth it
    due to convenience) and the problem is solved!

    Thanks for all the help from all who posted here.

    Dean.
    Dean Heighington, Jul 14, 2004
    #11
  12. Dean Heighington

    Ed Sirett Guest

    On Tue, 13 Jul 2004 15:41:48 -0700, Dean Heighington wrote:

    > "Ed Sirett" <> wrote in message news:
    >> This is because the relay does not swich over in response to the APS.

    >
    > APS?
    > Automatic Protection System (Switch) ??
    >

    No: Air Pressure Switch.

    It is a simple differential pressure switch (usually and in this case a
    changeover microswitch). The differential pressure is caused by the correct
    operation of the fan. It is operated by pressures in the order of a few millibars.

    --
    Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
    The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
    Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
    Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
    Ed Sirett, Jul 14, 2004
    #12
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