Handling a very heavy steel beam

Discussion in 'UK DIY' started by leenowell@yahoo.co.uk, Dec 19, 2007.

  1. Guest

    Hi,

    We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).

    The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    approx 2.5m from the ground).

    Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.

    thanks in advance for your help.

    Lee.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #1
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  2. Lobster Guest

    wrote:
    > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >
    > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > approx 2.5m from the ground).


    The 64,000 dollar question is what access there is at the back of the
    house - without that info nobody is going to be able to give you a
    sensible answer.

    David
     
    Lobster, Dec 19, 2007
    #2
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  3. Guest

    On 19 Dec, 09:12, Lobster <> wrote:
    > wrote:
    > > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).

    >
    > > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > > approx 2.5m from the ground).

    >
    > The 64,000 dollar question is what access there is at the back of the
    > house - without that info nobody is going to be able to give you a
    > sensible answer.
    >
    > David


    Good question...

    The access is pretty good. From the drive I have a pathway at the
    side of the house which is around 2.5/3m wide and then out onto lawn
    at the back. There is one hurdle (thinking about it now) that the
    back garden slopes down from right to left as you look at the house
    with an elevated patio in front (approx 2.5m deep - ie from house to
    end of patio). On the right the patio is about 10cm higher than the
    lawn rising to around 1.5m on the left with a couple of steps taking
    up the rise. The middle of the steel beam will be where the 10cm
    height different is.

    Hope this is clear????

    Thanks

    Lee.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #3
  4. Owain Guest

    wrote:
    > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).


    (a) big crane
    (b) rugby team and take it through the neighbours' gardens

    Owain
     
    Owain, Dec 19, 2007
    #4
  5. Guest

    A friend used a mobile crane hire earlier this year (to move his
    post&beam garage intact). The hire company quoted 2 prices, one to do
    the lift as you instruct (and you take responsibility), and a second
    rate they will take charge of the lift and ensure it's safe
    completion.

    Getting the crane company to do any over-the-house blind lift (i.e.
    the crane operator depends on remote instruction during the
    positioning) may be the answer to having the whole problem sorted in
    one go.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #5
  6. Guest

    On 19 Dec, 10:21, "Dave Baker" <> wrote:
    > <> wrote in message
    >
    > news:...
    >
    > > Hi,

    >
    > > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).

    >
    > Firstly a quick calc shows it shouldn't weigh anything like that much. No
    > more than half a ton even if it's made from 1cm thick metal. Maybe
    > considerably less. It's simple enough to work out if you have the exact
    > dimensions.
    >
    >
    >
    > > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > > approx 2.5m from the ground).

    >
    > > Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.

    >
    > > thanks in advance for your help.

    >
    > > Lee.

    >
    > It should be easy enough to roll it round the back on skates or even bits of
    > scaffold tube and then use a block and tackle (or two) to hoist it.
    > --
    > Dave Baker
    > Puma Race Engines


    Thanks all for your quick replies... To answer a few things raised.

    1. From an access perspective, getting the beam around the back should
    be fine so shouldn't need neighbours garden or over the house type
    lifting - thankfully
    2. From memory, the spec given by the engineer was around 120kg per M
    - would that sound correct?
    3. Builder has experience of this before by taking the "rugby team"
    approach and then sliding it into place on scaffold poles. Given the
    size of the beam and the "rugby team" required - thought there may be
    an easier option

    A couple of follow-up questions
    1. How much would a mini crane be for a day or 2? We have another few
    steels to fit so maybe renting one for the day would make these easier
    too - especially if it could be used to move the steels around the
    back to? I assume once lifted the steel can be rotated to be parallel
    to the direction of travel and the crane can move loaded?
    2. What are skates? I did a google and got some things which look
    like they are parts of a steel beam making machine rather than
    something that could roll over grass/ plywood
    3. Block and tackle sounds like an idea but assume we will also need
    to hire some support to attach the block and tackle to?

    Thanks again for all your help

    Lee.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #6
  7. Guest

    On 19 Dec, 11:03, Tony Bryer <> wrote:
    > On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 10:21:31 -0000 Dave Baker wrote :
    >
    > > > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > > > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > > > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).

    >
    > > Firstly a quick calc shows it shouldn't weigh anything like that much.
    > > No more than half a ton even if it's made from 1cm thick metal

    >
    > 300x300 UCs come in 7 rolling weights from 97 to 283kg/m so 1000kg is
    > perfectly possible. If it's possible to lift each end in turn by
    > degrees, then the lift weight is half this.
    >
    > I hope the designer/engineer has satisfied himself as to the adequacy of
    > what holds this beam up!
    >
    > --
    > Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk


    Me too...... He has specified a couple of steel box section
    columns.....

    The problem is with the 300mm height as I am keen to hide it in the
    space between the floor and ceiling above. With this spec, it will be
    150mm below the ceiling level which is not ideal.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #7
  8. somebody Guest

    In message
    <>,
    writes
    >Hi,
    >
    >We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    >steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    >about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >
    >The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    >cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    >the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    >will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    >approx 2.5m from the ground).
    >
    >Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.
    >
    >thanks in advance for your help.
    >
    >Lee.


    For lateral movement along the ground, I'd use rollers - possibly a
    scaffold pole cut into 2 foot lengths or so. If there is any incline up
    or down, pull or lower it using a turfer and suitable ground anchor(s).

    For the lift, a block and tackle on a frame of scaffolding - any decent
    high altitude tubular technician (scaffolder!) would probably be able to
    erect such a frame for the given weight.

    Bear in mind that if you dropped a beam of that weight even 1cm onto a
    finger/toe etc it would probably crush it, safety needs to be forefront
    in your mind during this.

    If you want to spend a bit of money, HSS have 'lift and shift' centres
    with specialist lifting gear, including demountable gantries, beam
    rollers, the various strops, ropes, block and tackle you might need etc.

    www.hss.co.uk

    Look under lifting and handling.

    Hth
    Someone
     
    somebody, Dec 19, 2007
    #8
  9. Steve Firth Guest

    <> wrote:

    > Hi,
    >
    > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >
    > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > approx 2.5m from the ground).
    >
    > Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.
    >
    > thanks in advance for your help.


    The builder could move it using his telehandler and then lift it into
    position.
     
    Steve Firth, Dec 19, 2007
    #9
  10. wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >
    > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > approx 2.5m from the ground).
    >
    > Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.
    >
    > thanks in advance for your help.
    >


    Mm. when manhgndling large oak beams to a similar level. we hauled them
    with a tractor digger, and hailed em up by hand..

    Its not beyond a high loader either.

    Or you can use jacks and props in succession to inch the thing up. Do
    build some sort of timber of scaffolding type structure to contain if it
    falls.

    I think I'd probably get the scaffolders in and build two sections
    either side, put beams across and then use pulleys to do the finml lift.

    Rolling it on scaffold poles to get it into place.

    Or just get a crane on a truck and have done with it ;-)


    > Lee.
     
    The Natural Philosopher, Dec 19, 2007
    #10
  11. Dave Baker wrote:
    > <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >> 2. What are skates?

    >
    > The things that machinery movers shift lathes and mills on. Like a heavy
    > duty roller skate with steel wheels. Your beam actually weighs about the
    > same as my lathe if your figures are correct and a machinery mover would be
    > an ideal person to ask how best to shift it.
    >
    > I did a google and got some things which look
    >> like they are parts of a steel beam making machine rather than
    >> something that could roll over grass/ plywood

    >
    > You can't use skates or scaffold tube on anything other than good flat
    > concrete or tarmac. If you have to shift anything that heavy over soft or
    > uneven ground you've got a whole new problem.


    Yes: You have to lay scaffold planks down to make a railway. Not rocket
    science is it?

    >
    >> 3. Block and tackle sounds like an idea but assume we will also need
    >> to hire some support to attach the block and tackle to?

    >
    > You rig up the scaffold using scaffold tube. Maybe not so easy to support
    > something that heavy though. I guess nowadays you need a risk analysis and
    > god knows what other formalities.


    Don't tell anyone.
     
    The Natural Philosopher, Dec 19, 2007
    #11
  12. George Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On 19 Dec, 10:21, "Dave Baker" <> wrote:
    > > <> wrote in message
    > >
    > >

    news:...
    > >
    > > > Hi,

    > >
    > > > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > > > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > > > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).

    > >
    > > Firstly a quick calc shows it shouldn't weigh anything like that much.

    No
    > > more than half a ton even if it's made from 1cm thick metal. Maybe
    > > considerably less. It's simple enough to work out if you have the exact
    > > dimensions.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > > > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > > > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > > > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > > > approx 2.5m from the ground).

    > >
    > > > Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.

    > >
    > > > thanks in advance for your help.

    > >
    > > > Lee.

    > >
    > > It should be easy enough to roll it round the back on skates or even

    bits of
    > > scaffold tube and then use a block and tackle (or two) to hoist it.
    > > --
    > > Dave Baker
    > > Puma Race Engines

    >
    > Thanks all for your quick replies... To answer a few things raised.
    >
    > 1. From an access perspective, getting the beam around the back should
    > be fine so shouldn't need neighbours garden or over the house type
    > lifting - thankfully
    > 2. From memory, the spec given by the engineer was around 120kg per M
    > - would that sound correct?
    > 3. Builder has experience of this before by taking the "rugby team"
    > approach and then sliding it into place on scaffold poles. Given the
    > size of the beam and the "rugby team" required - thought there may be
    > an easier option
    >
    > A couple of follow-up questions
    > 1. How much would a mini crane be for a day or 2? We have another few
    > steels to fit so maybe renting one for the day would make these easier
    > too - especially if it could be used to move the steels around the
    > back to? I assume once lifted the steel can be rotated to be parallel
    > to the direction of travel and the crane can move loaded?
    > 2. What are skates? I did a google and got some things which look
    > like they are parts of a steel beam making machine rather than
    > something that could roll over grass/ plywood
    > 3. Block and tackle sounds like an idea but assume we will also need
    > to hire some support to attach the block and tackle to?
    >
    > Thanks again for all your help
    >
    > Lee.


    Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle up
    to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the cradle.
     
    George, Dec 19, 2007
    #12
  13. George wrote:

    >Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    >position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle up
    >to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the cradle.
    >

    That must be a pretty beefy cherry picker. I wouldn't want to
    write the safe system of work.

    Chris
    --
    Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


    Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.
     
    Chris J Dixon, Dec 19, 2007
    #13
  14. George Guest

    "Chris J Dixon" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > George wrote:
    >
    > >Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    > >position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle

    up
    > >to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the

    cradle.
    > >

    > That must be a pretty beefy cherry picker. I wouldn't want to
    > write the safe system of work.
    >
    > Chris
    > --
    > Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
    >
    >
    > Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.


    Some of them can take the weight of 7300kg,his beam only weighs 1000kg
    http://www.capitalaccess.co.uk/equipment.php
     
    George, Dec 19, 2007
    #14
  15. Guest

    On 19 Dec, 15:21, "George" <> wrote:
    > "Chris J Dixon" <> wrote in messagenews:...
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > > George wrote:

    >
    > > >Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    > > >position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle

    > up
    > > >to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the

    > cradle.
    >
    > > That must be a pretty beefy cherry picker. I wouldn't want to
    > > write the safe system of work.

    >
    > > Chris
    > > --
    > > Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
    > >

    >
    > > Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.

    >
    > Some of them can take the weight of 7300kg,his beam only weighs 1000kghttp://www.capitalaccess.co.uk/equipment.php- Hide quoted text -
    >
    > - Show quoted text -


    All,

    Just to clarify, the beam itself is an "I" beam which is supported
    either end by 2 box section columns.

    Also interesting to see Ray's post as this is exactly what we are
    doing and his steel seems a fair bit smaller. In fact, half the steel
    is supporting the upstairs wall and roof (rafters run parallel so less
    support I guess) and the other half is supporting the roof above.

    This is great dialog

    thanks
    Lee.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #15
  16. Guest

    On 19 Dec, 15:51, wrote:
    > On 19 Dec, 15:21, "George" <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > > "Chris J Dixon" <> wrote in messagenews:...

    >
    > > > George wrote:

    >
    > > > >Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    > > > >position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle

    > > up
    > > > >to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the

    > > cradle.

    >
    > > > That must be a pretty beefy cherry picker. I wouldn't want to
    > > > write the safe system of work.

    >
    > > > Chris
    > > > --
    > > > Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
    > > >

    >
    > > > Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.

    >
    > > Some of them can take the weight of 7300kg,his beam only weighs 1000kghttp://www.capitalaccess.co.uk/equipment.php-Hide quoted text -

    >
    > > - Show quoted text -

    >
    > All,
    >
    > Just to clarify, the beam itself is an "I" beam which is supported
    > either end by 2 box section columns.
    >
    > Also interesting to see Ray's post as this is exactly what we are
    > doing and his steel seems a fair bit smaller. In fact, half the steel
    > is supporting the upstairs wall and roof (rafters run parallel so less
    > support I guess) and the other half is supporting the roof above.
    >
    > This is great dialog
    >
    > thanks
    > Lee.- Hide quoted text -
    >
    > - Show quoted text -


    George - Just looking at the cherry pickers, how did you get the steel
    on to the platform without destroying the surround/ railings etc.?

    thanks
    Lee.
     
    , Dec 19, 2007
    #16
  17. George wrote:
    > <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> On 19 Dec, 10:21, "Dave Baker" <> wrote:
    >>> <> wrote in message
    >>>
    >>>

    > news:...
    >>>> Hi,
    >>>> We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    >>>> steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    >>>> about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >>> Firstly a quick calc shows it shouldn't weigh anything like that much.

    > No
    >>> more than half a ton even if it's made from 1cm thick metal. Maybe
    >>> considerably less. It's simple enough to work out if you have the exact
    >>> dimensions.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    >>>> cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    >>>> the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    >>>> will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    >>>> approx 2.5m from the ground).
    >>>> Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.
    >>>> thanks in advance for your help.
    >>>> Lee.
    >>> It should be easy enough to roll it round the back on skates or even

    > bits of
    >>> scaffold tube and then use a block and tackle (or two) to hoist it.
    >>> --
    >>> Dave Baker
    >>> Puma Race Engines

    >> Thanks all for your quick replies... To answer a few things raised.
    >>
    >> 1. From an access perspective, getting the beam around the back should
    >> be fine so shouldn't need neighbours garden or over the house type
    >> lifting - thankfully
    >> 2. From memory, the spec given by the engineer was around 120kg per M
    >> - would that sound correct?
    >> 3. Builder has experience of this before by taking the "rugby team"
    >> approach and then sliding it into place on scaffold poles. Given the
    >> size of the beam and the "rugby team" required - thought there may be
    >> an easier option
    >>
    >> A couple of follow-up questions
    >> 1. How much would a mini crane be for a day or 2? We have another few
    >> steels to fit so maybe renting one for the day would make these easier
    >> too - especially if it could be used to move the steels around the
    >> back to? I assume once lifted the steel can be rotated to be parallel
    >> to the direction of travel and the crane can move loaded?
    >> 2. What are skates? I did a google and got some things which look
    >> like they are parts of a steel beam making machine rather than
    >> something that could roll over grass/ plywood
    >> 3. Block and tackle sounds like an idea but assume we will also need
    >> to hire some support to attach the block and tackle to?
    >>
    >> Thanks again for all your help
    >>
    >> Lee.

    >
    > Cherry picker,lot cheaper than a crane hire.
    > position the beam on the cherry picers cradle then just gear the cradle up
    > to the position and forward it into positon with the controls of the cradle.
    >
    >

    the problem here is what the ground immediately under the beam is like.
    In our case ( 14" square 6 meter long oak beam. Not quite as heavy as
    the steel here. but still made us pretty thoughtful when it was being
    levered into place), we couldn't get one in..


    Ultimately we used a sdmall tracor to drag the beams into more or less
    the pisitioon,..and lift ecah end on a froint bucket, and shove themn
    around that way, then IIRC it was up on some trestles made for thejob,
    using lots of blokes and slings, then slings on each end and a bit of
    tractor bucket to hoist each end, acrows underneath with some stability
    braces on half way up, and then levering sweating and cursing to do the
    final placement.
     
    The Natural Philosopher, Dec 19, 2007
    #17
  18. George wrote:

    >Some of them can take the weight of 7300kg,his beam only weighs 1000kg
    >http://www.capitalaccess.co.uk/equipment.php
    >

    Which ones on that page?

    Chris
    --
    Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


    Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.
     
    Chris J Dixon, Dec 19, 2007
    #18
  19. wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > We are having work done on our house and it involves a big and heavy
    > steel beam to support most of the back of the house. It is probably
    > about 1000kg and 7m long (300mm x 300mm).
    >
    > The builder and I are trying to figure out the best/ easiest/ most
    > cost effective way of getting the beam from the lorry at the front of
    > the house to the back of the house then up onto the steel columns that
    > will be supporting it. The beam will be at first floor level (i.e.
    > approx 2.5m from the ground).
    >
    > Any thoughts on how to resolve this would be gratefully appreciated.


    Apparently the way they got the horizontal stones in place at Stonehenge was
    to lever up one end, put a chock under, then lever up the other end, chock
    under etc etc. When the horizontal stone was at the right height it was
    slid sideways onto the uprights.


    --
    Dave - The Medway Handyman
    www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
    01634 717930
    07850 597257
     
    The Medway Handyman, Dec 19, 2007
    #19
  20. Owain Guest

    The Natural Philosopher wrote:
    > Yes: You have to lay scaffold planks down to make a railway. Not rocket
    > science is it?


    No, but it is Rocket science :)

    Owain
     
    Owain, Dec 19, 2007
    #20
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