Chainsaw "Square ground cutter" sharpening?

Discussion in 'Home Repair' started by Bill, Oct 8, 2005.

  1. Bill

    Bill Guest

    Question: How do you properly sharpen a saw chain with a "square ground
    cutter"? (This is flat filed as opposed to round filed.)

    The chain with these square ground cutters is Stihl RSLFK, RSLK, or RSLHK.
    ( http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/types.html )

    Do you just use a flat file and free-hand (without any guide)?

    I found some information on this at the Oregon saw-chain web site. It says;
    "Only use files specially designed for square-ground chisel cutters,
    available from your chainsaw dealer." [Double-Bevel, Hexagon, and "Goofy".]
    This was on the last page of the following link...
    http://www.oregonchain.com/tech/ms_manual/ms_06.pdf

    Anyone know where to buy these files online? Or which type of file is best
    to use?

    Comments/Opinions on saw chain which is "square ground" -vs- "round ground"?
     
    Bill, Oct 8, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Bill

    Mike Marlow Guest

    "Bill" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Question: How do you properly sharpen a saw chain with a "square ground
    > cutter"? (This is flat filed as opposed to round filed.)
    >
    > The chain with these square ground cutters is Stihl RSLFK, RSLK, or RSLHK.
    > ( http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/types.html )
    >
    > Do you just use a flat file and free-hand (without any guide)?
    >
    > I found some information on this at the Oregon saw-chain web site. It

    says;
    > "Only use files specially designed for square-ground chisel cutters,
    > available from your chainsaw dealer." [Double-Bevel, Hexagon, and

    "Goofy".]
    > This was on the last page of the following link...
    > http://www.oregonchain.com/tech/ms_manual/ms_06.pdf
    >
    > Anyone know where to buy these files online? Or which type of file is best
    > to use?
    >
    > Comments/Opinions on saw chain which is "square ground" -vs- "round

    ground"?
    >
    >


    Bill:

    Just based on your questions, it appears you're not terribly experienced
    with chainsaws. If I've read too much into your questions then I guess you
    can ignore everything else I have to say and accept my apologies. If
    however, you are as unfamiliar with chainsaws as your questions make it
    appear, then my immediate advice is for you not to screw around with square
    ground cutters.

    Sharpening any chain requires a certain amount of practice in order to get a
    good cutting profile. It's certainly more than just hitting the cutters a
    few licks to sharpen them up. It's not rocket science by any means, and
    anybody can certainly develop the skill to do it, but it does require an
    attention to what you're doing, and understanding of what you want to do and
    of course the most important part - a practice at achieving that desired
    goal. Square cutters are a lot harder to cut properly and offer nothing to
    the fellow who isn't cutting very large diameter trees with huge saws. You
    just can't get into wood cutting enough on a casual basis to warrant going
    to a square chain. They rely on a critical angle between the top of the
    cutter and the side and slight variations - which are easy to end up with,
    will really screw up the cut.

    Do yourself a favor and just stay with the chain your saw came with.

    --

    -Mike-
     
    Mike Marlow, Oct 8, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Bill

    Harry K Guest

    Bill wrote:
    > Question: How do you properly sharpen a saw chain with a "square ground
    > cutter"? (This is flat filed as opposed to round filed.)
    >
    > The chain with these square ground cutters is Stihl RSLFK, RSLK, or RSLHK.
    > ( http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/types.html )
    >
    > Do you just use a flat file and free-hand (without any guide)?
    >
    > I found some information on this at the Oregon saw-chain web site. It says;
    > "Only use files specially designed for square-ground chisel cutters,
    > available from your chainsaw dealer." [Double-Bevel, Hexagon, and "Goofy".]
    > This was on the last page of the following link...
    > http://www.oregonchain.com/tech/ms_manual/ms_06.pdf
    >
    > Anyone know where to buy these files online? Or which type of file is best
    > to use?
    >
    > Comments/Opinions on saw chain which is "square ground" -vs- "round ground"?


    Don't bother unless you are a professional. I wound up with a square
    chisel chain by accident once. Loved the way it cut. Could not file
    it by hand, dealer had no way of sharpening it. We converted it to
    round file - just use a round file and the usual angles.

    I hang out in a professional arborist/logging forum. Even the
    professionals have a very hard time learning to file square cutters.
    Angles, pressures etc. are critical.

    Harry K
     
    Harry K, Oct 8, 2005
    #3
  4. Thanks for the site - haven't looked - but have now - have a 192-T Pico chain.
    Just found out tonight on the page - under the model page - there is a recall.
    Safety item.
    Really nice 6.6# saw for high and light work.

    Have a 20" for the big stuff. :)
    Martin
    Martin Eastburn
    @ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
    NRA LOH, NRA Life
    NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



    Bill wrote:
    > Question: How do you properly sharpen a saw chain with a "square ground
    > cutter"? (This is flat filed as opposed to round filed.)
    >
    > The chain with these square ground cutters is Stihl RSLFK, RSLK, or RSLHK.
    > ( http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/types.html )
    >
    > Do you just use a flat file and free-hand (without any guide)?
    >
    > I found some information on this at the Oregon saw-chain web site. It says;
    > "Only use files specially designed for square-ground chisel cutters,
    > available from your chainsaw dealer." [Double-Bevel, Hexagon, and "Goofy".]
    > This was on the last page of the following link...
    > http://www.oregonchain.com/tech/ms_manual/ms_06.pdf
    >
    > Anyone know where to buy these files online? Or which type of file is best
    > to use?
    >
    > Comments/Opinions on saw chain which is "square ground" -vs- "round ground"?
    >
    >


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    Martin H. Eastburn, Oct 9, 2005
    #4
  5. Bill

    Bill Guest

    The chain the saw came with *does* come (from Stihl) with square ground
    cutters. It is a Stihl "RSLFK" (full skip) chain for a Stihl MS-460 and a 32
    inch bar. This chainsaw will *only* be used for bucking large diameter logs.
    (I have a smaller chainsaw with round filed cutters which I use for the
    smaller stuff.)

    I do have experience with the round filed chains, but not with the square
    ground chains.

    I have read on the internet that a square ground chain has a bit of
    additional cutting speed, and that is important to me as the logs I am
    cutting are quite large in diameter. So worth the investment in learning how
    to sharpen the chain for square ground if it is worth it - cutting speed
    wise.

    Although the chain came with square ground cutters, I do have the option of
    filing them with a round file and no longer having square ground cutters.

    I have a friend who has been a logger for 15 years and he says he prefers
    round filed, although other loggers prefer square ground he says.

    I told him I wanted to try the square ground for awhile, then file them with
    a round file and see which I prefer. (And I should learn something in the
    process.)

    Just wanted some additional feedback on which is better and tips on
    sharpening. Also where to get the special files online if possible.



    "Mike Marlow" wrote in message
    >
    > Bill:
    >
    > Just based on your questions, it appears you're not terribly experienced
    > with chainsaws. If I've read too much into your questions then I guess
    > you
    > can ignore everything else I have to say and accept my apologies. If
    > however, you are as unfamiliar with chainsaws as your questions make it
    > appear, then my immediate advice is for you not to screw around with
    > square
    > ground cutters.
    >
    > Sharpening any chain requires a certain amount of practice in order to get
    > a
    > good cutting profile. It's certainly more than just hitting the cutters a
    > few licks to sharpen them up. It's not rocket science by any means, and
    > anybody can certainly develop the skill to do it, but it does require an
    > attention to what you're doing, and understanding of what you want to do
    > and
    > of course the most important part - a practice at achieving that desired
    > goal. Square cutters are a lot harder to cut properly and offer nothing
    > to
    > the fellow who isn't cutting very large diameter trees with huge saws.
    > You
    > just can't get into wood cutting enough on a casual basis to warrant going
    > to a square chain. They rely on a critical angle between the top of the
    > cutter and the side and slight variations - which are easy to end up with,
    > will really screw up the cut.
    >
    > Do yourself a favor and just stay with the chain your saw came with.
    >
     
    Bill, Oct 9, 2005
    #5
  6. Years ago, I read about the difference between "chisel" and "chipper" and
    "Semichisel" chain.

    Chisel had square teeth, and chipper had rounded corners on the teeth. From
    the end, chisel chain looked like a 7, and chipper chain teeth looked more
    like a ?.

    The chisel chain was supposed to be faster cut.

    --

    Christopher A. Young
    Do good work.
    It's longer in the short run
    but shorter in the long run.
    ..
    ..


    "Bill" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    The chain the saw came with *does* come (from Stihl) with square ground
    cutters. It is a Stihl "RSLFK" (full skip) chain for a Stihl MS-460 and a 32
    inch bar. This chainsaw will *only* be used for bucking large diameter logs.
    (I have a smaller chainsaw with round filed cutters which I use for the
    smaller stuff.)

    I do have experience with the round filed chains, but not with the square
    ground chains.

    I have read on the internet that a square ground chain has a bit of
    additional cutting speed, and that is important to me as the logs I am
    cutting are quite large in diameter. So worth the investment in learning how
    to sharpen the chain for square ground if it is worth it - cutting speed
    wise.

    Although the chain came with square ground cutters, I do have the option of
    filing them with a round file and no longer having square ground cutters.

    I have a friend who has been a logger for 15 years and he says he prefers
    round filed, although other loggers prefer square ground he says.

    I told him I wanted to try the square ground for awhile, then file them with
    a round file and see which I prefer. (And I should learn something in the
    process.)

    Just wanted some additional feedback on which is better and tips on
    sharpening. Also where to get the special files online if possible.
     
    Stormin Mormon, Oct 9, 2005
    #6
  7. Bill

    Bill Guest

    "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
    > Years ago, I read about the difference between "chisel" and "chipper" and
    > "Semichisel" chain.
    >
    > Chisel had square teeth, and chipper had rounded corners on the teeth.
    > From
    > the end, chisel chain looked like a 7, and chipper chain teeth looked more
    > like a ?.
    >
    > The chisel chain was supposed to be faster cut.
    >



    The cutters on my chain look like "7's". Following are all the different
    variations of saw chain you can get from Stihl...

    Pitch
    1 = 1/4"
    2 = .325"
    3 = 3/8"
    4 = .404"
    6 = PICCO (3/8" Extended)

    Gauge (on drive link)
    1 = .043" (1.1 mm)
    3 = .050" (1.3 mm)
    5 = .058" (1.5 mm)
    6 = .063" (1.6 mm)
    0 = .080" (2.0 mm) (Harvester Chain Only)

    Cutter Type
    P = PICCO
    R = RAPID

    Cutter Shape
    C = Comfort (Low Vibe Version)
    D = Duro (Carbide Tip)
    DS= Duro Special (Carbide Tip)
    M = Micro (Semi-Chisel)
    S = Super (Full Chisel)

    Special
    1 = Triple-Humped Tie Strap
    2 = Triple-Humped Tie Strap
    3 = Single-Humped Drive Link
    F = Full Skip
    H = Semi Skip
    L = Square Ground
    K = Classic Cutter design
    N = Narrow
    S = Special

    Number of Drive Links in Reels
    Type 100'
    1/4" 2400
    3/8" PMN 1640
    3/8" P 1640
    ..325" 1840
    3/8" 1640
    ..404" 1480

    Various Stihl Cutter Types...
    http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/types.html

    Stihl Saw Chain Identification...
    http://www.stihlusa.com/chainsaws/sawchain_select_id.pdf
     
    Bill, Oct 9, 2005
    #7
  8. Bill

    Bill Guest

    Bill, Oct 9, 2005
    #8
  9. Bill

    Harry K Guest

    Go to arborist.lawnsite.com

    That is a professional and semi professional forum although anyone is
    welcome. Search the "chainsaw" forum for filing info. You will find
    more than you really want but will find what you need. It will also
    give you on-line sources for chainsaws/tools/etc.

    Baileys.com (I think that's right) is one off the top of my head.

    Harry K
     
    Harry K, Oct 9, 2005
    #9
  10. Bill

    Bill Guest

    Thanks. I found what I was looking for by searching that forum. The first
    link below says...

    Q: Is a square ground chisel chain really better than a round ground chisel
    chain?
    A: Yes, if cutting performance and efficiency are what you are after. Square
    ground chisel chains perform 10% to 15% better. If maximum stay sharp
    ability and ease of filing are your objective, the answer is: no.

    Maintenance of square ground chisel saw chain...
    http://www.madsens1.com/chainmnt.htm

    Also baileys.com had a bottle of booze on it!
    Is this the site?
    http://www.baileys-online.com



    "Harry K" wrote in message
    > Go to arborist.lawnsite.com
    >
    > That is a professional and semi professional forum although anyone is
    > welcome. Search the "chainsaw" forum for filing info. You will find
    > more than you really want but will find what you need. It will also
    > give you on-line sources for chainsaws/tools/etc.
    >
    > Baileys.com (I think that's right) is one off the top of my head.
    >
    > Harry K
    >
     
    Bill, Oct 9, 2005
    #10
  11. Bill

    Harry K Guest

    Yeah, that's it. Sorry about that.

    The Arborist site is one awesome resource. I hope you sign up and
    join in some of the discussions. Asbestos pants might be required in
    some of them. You would probably enjoy looking through some of the
    archives.

    Harry K
     
    Harry K, Oct 9, 2005
    #11
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